Innocent flirting?
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alcifertoh
New Member
All high profile ppl there. There was this once when I was going to the hotel beside for a wedding banquet. I exited from the wrong side of the carpark and saw all the high end cars there as if it's an automative gala. Starting from Fairlady lining up.
I thought that the couple had so much high profile contacts till I realise it's the front porch of the clubs
From door way I just saw business ppl mingling with each other and behaving appropriately. Not like those you see on TV with loose clothings and behaving in a rowdy manner.
Of course there might be other things going on too. It's subjected to individual's behaviour.
I thought that the couple had so much high profile contacts till I realise it's the front porch of the clubs
Of course there might be other things going on too. It's subjected to individual's behaviour.
lookingback
New Member
ya, u dun go there and spend $50/=.
sgbabydoll
Active Member
"u can drop by and see the ladies going to work or leaving with customers. Places of vices, the gals are basically there for one objective. Money."
It's like our offices. We also work for money. Can't be friendship that we are working for mah hehe
It's like our offices. We also work for money. Can't be friendship that we are working for mah hehe
Normal expenditure can "smelly smelly" hit 4 digits.... My frends (men & women) go there for business.... I would not say it's a place for "leisure" unless one has tonnes of $$$ to throw....
I ever asked my friend (guys): Aren't U tempted at all??? His respond is "That place is a wonderland for Guy's to boost their EGO.... Every gals will smile at U... Be it U Yandao or not.... Wahahahah...............
No $ no talk
I ever asked my friend (guys): Aren't U tempted at all??? His respond is "That place is a wonderland for Guy's to boost their EGO.... Every gals will smile at U... Be it U Yandao or not.... Wahahahah...............
No $ no talk
miloice
Well-Known Member
doll...
it depends on the kind of biz it is mah.
This is a place for entertainment and its quite up-market. But its not a place u go to know potential dates normally. When in a strip bar, u know those gals are there for the money and not for the love to bear in front of strangers. You can probably try to pay for extra services there but not the office. I find the comparison weird.
Just as one goes to pubs for ONS. But it doesn't mean we cannot have clean fun or watch soccer. We work not just for money. But the main activity in such places are pretty obvious.
it depends on the kind of biz it is mah.
This is a place for entertainment and its quite up-market. But its not a place u go to know potential dates normally. When in a strip bar, u know those gals are there for the money and not for the love to bear in front of strangers. You can probably try to pay for extra services there but not the office. I find the comparison weird.
Just as one goes to pubs for ONS. But it doesn't mean we cannot have clean fun or watch soccer. We work not just for money. But the main activity in such places are pretty obvious.
green_tranquility
New Member
Milo,
We chatters ever went to pubs to watch live soccer matches. It's more fun to watch soccer in a big group and scream at the goals together!
ONS can happen anywhere, e.g. dating sites. SGB sekali also got such "deals" LOL. Where is Powderful with her 36D tits and toufu skin? We need her to be bait for predators on SGB.
We chatters ever went to pubs to watch live soccer matches. It's more fun to watch soccer in a big group and scream at the goals together!
ONS can happen anywhere, e.g. dating sites. SGB sekali also got such "deals" LOL. Where is Powderful with her 36D tits and toufu skin? We need her to be bait for predators on SGB.
sgbabydoll
Active Member
Milo, you totally missed what I was trying to say.....I was merely telling you everyone works for money whether you work at your so-called places of vices or in the office. I wouldn't say we are any better but we do have a better work environment in the office compared to KTV girls or those in strip tease. Also, we are not as hungry and can afford to be selective.
To me the office is also not a place to look for romance leh. Also, not everything that lands on our plate is what we like. There are aspects of our job that we do not like at all.
There is also a fair amount of sleeping around in the office. Perhaps the difference is that there is no paid sex.
To me the office is also not a place to look for romance leh. Also, not everything that lands on our plate is what we like. There are aspects of our job that we do not like at all.
There is also a fair amount of sleeping around in the office. Perhaps the difference is that there is no paid sex.
one of the reasons i didn't wanna speak too much on this topic is becos it's unlikely to change anything - there are already pre-conceived notions etched in pple's minds. same with how most assume academics to be proportionate to income... just tat i'm a whole lot more passionate abt the latter, than ktvs.
But i do draw lessons, which i'm not gonna be politically-correct abt... and tat is tat many of these ladies are alot more passionate and entreprenial abt their lives, and definitely take more risks in building a future for themselves without the environment we've taken for granted. i dun see them any more different than our foremothers who came as samsui women leaving their country for an opportunity just to do better. i'm not speaking for them, but just drawing lessons to be appreciative of our luck in being born in s'pore, the gov we have and the opportunities tat we're accustomed to expect... so much so tat we do get ahead of ourselves sometimes and think we're better simply by virtue of things which we never needed to work for.
end of the day, all of us work for money... those of us with 'cleaner', white-collar, blue-collar or more snob-jobs should realise tat regardless of how much we think we're different, we're all working for money... and this money Has a purpose. we sometimes conveniently forget tat some of our idols like sylvester stallone, the late leslie cheung and shuqi went thru some sleaze of their own in soft-porn - which i suppose is for money as well... and perhaps fame too...
But i do draw lessons, which i'm not gonna be politically-correct abt... and tat is tat many of these ladies are alot more passionate and entreprenial abt their lives, and definitely take more risks in building a future for themselves without the environment we've taken for granted. i dun see them any more different than our foremothers who came as samsui women leaving their country for an opportunity just to do better. i'm not speaking for them, but just drawing lessons to be appreciative of our luck in being born in s'pore, the gov we have and the opportunities tat we're accustomed to expect... so much so tat we do get ahead of ourselves sometimes and think we're better simply by virtue of things which we never needed to work for.
end of the day, all of us work for money... those of us with 'cleaner', white-collar, blue-collar or more snob-jobs should realise tat regardless of how much we think we're different, we're all working for money... and this money Has a purpose. we sometimes conveniently forget tat some of our idols like sylvester stallone, the late leslie cheung and shuqi went thru some sleaze of their own in soft-porn - which i suppose is for money as well... and perhaps fame too...
miloice
Well-Known Member
Doll & Green,
u did not understand what I'm saying. Just as you don't expect most people to go to casino or turf club to watch only. Most are there to gamble. For KTV, the main reason are really the entertainment. For sure sales people needs to entertain their clients to places they like.
I did not say its not possible to have clean fun in these places. I watched big matches in pubs too for the great atmostphere. Isn't that one of the common reasons for going to a pub? Nothing really weird about that. But, would anyone claim to study not in a library but in a pub? Simply Because its possible?? But, its simply logical reasoning. I really dunno what the TS is trying to find out from these questions.
I'm not saying which is better off.
Its simply logical to expect people to go to up-market KTV not to find dates but for entertainment.
Whether the guy wants to go beyond that, no one can tell. TS is asking for objective views. That's mine. And probably, at the right price, one is probably more likely to succeed to get the extra service in places of vices. Its really a no brainer.
"There is also a fair amount of sleeping around in the office. Perhaps the difference is that there is no paid sex." And do you not see the reason behind the difference? That's really what I was pointing out. Not many really like to be in such jobs. They are in it for only 1 real goal. The big money. If they are paid like a office clerks, would you think these gals will even consider working there??
u did not understand what I'm saying. Just as you don't expect most people to go to casino or turf club to watch only. Most are there to gamble. For KTV, the main reason are really the entertainment. For sure sales people needs to entertain their clients to places they like.
I did not say its not possible to have clean fun in these places. I watched big matches in pubs too for the great atmostphere. Isn't that one of the common reasons for going to a pub? Nothing really weird about that. But, would anyone claim to study not in a library but in a pub? Simply Because its possible?? But, its simply logical reasoning. I really dunno what the TS is trying to find out from these questions.
I'm not saying which is better off.
Its simply logical to expect people to go to up-market KTV not to find dates but for entertainment.
Whether the guy wants to go beyond that, no one can tell. TS is asking for objective views. That's mine. And probably, at the right price, one is probably more likely to succeed to get the extra service in places of vices. Its really a no brainer.
"There is also a fair amount of sleeping around in the office. Perhaps the difference is that there is no paid sex." And do you not see the reason behind the difference? That's really what I was pointing out. Not many really like to be in such jobs. They are in it for only 1 real goal. The big money. If they are paid like a office clerks, would you think these gals will even consider working there??
miloice
Well-Known Member
Powder, what political corrections are you talking about? I dun understand WHY everyone seems to think there is some discrimination here. What I'm trying to explain is taken totally out of the context. I'm not saying every person in a pub is looking for ONS nor every person in KTV is looking for SEX.
The point is really to say, one is more likely to get paid sex IF HE WANTS in places of vices vs your office. GET IT?
ALL,
please don't go on with blah blah blah about these pre-conceived notions stuffs. It is NEVER MY INTENTION to be talking on this agenda at all. Thank you.
This comparison with office is totally not related with what I'm saying. NO ONE says affairs happens only in places of vices. In fact, I tend to think it could be the opposite, because we are probably more on guard. Why? because we expect the temptation to come in these places. WHY DID WE HAVE THIS EXPECTATION??? Because of "pre-conceived notions". Come on lah, this is totally off the point!
Its like I tell u I feel like eating chicken rice today, so obviously I go to chicken rice store. Then, you challenged me that I can also go there to buy other stuffs or accompany friends or visit the hawker. And that I can also buy from the food court, restaurant or cook it at home. That's damn irritating and taking the context completely OUT.
The point is really to say, one is more likely to get paid sex IF HE WANTS in places of vices vs your office. GET IT?
ALL,
please don't go on with blah blah blah about these pre-conceived notions stuffs. It is NEVER MY INTENTION to be talking on this agenda at all. Thank you.
This comparison with office is totally not related with what I'm saying. NO ONE says affairs happens only in places of vices. In fact, I tend to think it could be the opposite, because we are probably more on guard. Why? because we expect the temptation to come in these places. WHY DID WE HAVE THIS EXPECTATION??? Because of "pre-conceived notions". Come on lah, this is totally off the point!
Its like I tell u I feel like eating chicken rice today, so obviously I go to chicken rice store. Then, you challenged me that I can also go there to buy other stuffs or accompany friends or visit the hawker. And that I can also buy from the food court, restaurant or cook it at home. That's damn irritating and taking the context completely OUT.
sgbabydoll
Active Member
Milo
I find your posts very hard to follow. You talked about KTV girls then suddenly switched to patrons. I was only trying to comment on your comment about KTV girls by likening to office people, that we all work for money primarily. I didn't talk about patrons.
I find your posts very hard to follow. You talked about KTV girls then suddenly switched to patrons. I was only trying to comment on your comment about KTV girls by likening to office people, that we all work for money primarily. I didn't talk about patrons.
miloice
Well-Known Member
Doll,
it is a direct answer to TS queries.
This is what I wrote :
"actually, it depends how far the clients want to go. no?
u can drop by and see the ladies going to work or leaving with customers. Places of vices, the gals are basically there for one objective. Money."
Its about the clients. i.e. HOW FAR THEY WANT TO GO.
BUT you choose to take it negatively to focus on the gals. We are mostly in jobs for more than one single objective. Unlike jobs of vices. Its not something MOST people (this includes people in that service) willingly go into. There is little aspirations and career advancement in the profession unlike in a corporate. Many have their problems and difficulties. Which is why the single strong motivation for them is really money. Nothing really discriminating towards the gals. They wanted a better life or needed the money badly and fast and they worked hard for it still.
"Also, we are not as hungry and can afford to be selective." Yes, they are hungry, and therefore more willing to provide the services to meet the demands. So??? this is the point really isn't it? Places of vices, the supply is readily available as long as the price is right. This points to the CLIENTS. No one can force anything down their throats.
You go into a street with hungry starving folks with gold and everything. You would expect to be robbed. Most of them really just want to survive. Are you going tell me, we are all needing to survive anything and its probably the same as walking in the office??
it is a direct answer to TS queries.
This is what I wrote :
"actually, it depends how far the clients want to go. no?
u can drop by and see the ladies going to work or leaving with customers. Places of vices, the gals are basically there for one objective. Money."
Its about the clients. i.e. HOW FAR THEY WANT TO GO.
BUT you choose to take it negatively to focus on the gals. We are mostly in jobs for more than one single objective. Unlike jobs of vices. Its not something MOST people (this includes people in that service) willingly go into. There is little aspirations and career advancement in the profession unlike in a corporate. Many have their problems and difficulties. Which is why the single strong motivation for them is really money. Nothing really discriminating towards the gals. They wanted a better life or needed the money badly and fast and they worked hard for it still.
"Also, we are not as hungry and can afford to be selective." Yes, they are hungry, and therefore more willing to provide the services to meet the demands. So??? this is the point really isn't it? Places of vices, the supply is readily available as long as the price is right. This points to the CLIENTS. No one can force anything down their throats.
You go into a street with hungry starving folks with gold and everything. You would expect to be robbed. Most of them really just want to survive. Are you going tell me, we are all needing to survive anything and its probably the same as walking in the office??
sgbabydoll
Active Member
Milo, I was commenting on your "places of vice".
Let me quote you the meaning of "vice" from The Free Dictionary at www.thefreedictionary.com.
Vice
a. An evil, degrading, or immoral practice or habit.
b. A serious moral failing.
c. Wicked or evil conduct or habits; corruption.
2. Sexual immorality, especially prostitution.
3a. A slight personal failing; a foible: the vice of untidiness.
3b. A flaw or imperfection; a defect.
4. A physical defect or weakness.
5. An undesirable habit, such as crib-biting, in a domestic animal.
6a. Vice - A character representing generalized or particular vice in English morality plays.
6b. A jester or buffoon.
It's a word that carries negative connotation. How was I supposed to infer otherwise?
Let me quote you the meaning of "vice" from The Free Dictionary at www.thefreedictionary.com.
Vice
a. An evil, degrading, or immoral practice or habit.
b. A serious moral failing.
c. Wicked or evil conduct or habits; corruption.
2. Sexual immorality, especially prostitution.
3a. A slight personal failing; a foible: the vice of untidiness.
3b. A flaw or imperfection; a defect.
4. A physical defect or weakness.
5. An undesirable habit, such as crib-biting, in a domestic animal.
6a. Vice - A character representing generalized or particular vice in English morality plays.
6b. A jester or buffoon.
It's a word that carries negative connotation. How was I supposed to infer otherwise?
miloice
Well-Known Member
Places of vice suggests that vices activites are rampant. It doesn't mean everyone is a criminal. COMPLETE DIFFERENT.
Despite my clarifications that its about client, u choose to continue to pick up words to dispute. For what? Don't u think its getting pointless? I may not have used the most appropriate words and despite pointing out clearly my context and intentions, u choose to continue on.............
Despite my clarifications that its about client, u choose to continue to pick up words to dispute. For what? Don't u think its getting pointless? I may not have used the most appropriate words and despite pointing out clearly my context and intentions, u choose to continue on.............
sgbabydoll
Active Member
Take away your pay from the job, do you think the other factors add together really matter much to why you are working? Not at all lor.
So, end of the day, we all work primarily for money lah.
So, end of the day, we all work primarily for money lah.
miloice
Well-Known Member
u pay me the pay of soccer stars, I would consider being a duck too. The MONEY is different. Given the opportunity for the same pay they can draw from other profession, do you think they would choose this path? Some maybe, but surely many others would not. You said it yourself, they are more hungry and less selective.
I give 10 cents, u give me one USD million. Can?? All money what. This analogy one is very extreme contrasting with the intention for you realize what the differences. u cannot compare like this and SUGGEST negativity on my part. Its not an apple and apple comparison at all.
I give 10 cents, u give me one USD million. Can?? All money what. This analogy one is very extreme contrasting with the intention for you realize what the differences. u cannot compare like this and SUGGEST negativity on my part. Its not an apple and apple comparison at all.
sgbabydoll
Active Member
Because you have been trying to say that it's different. It's the same, for money, the only difference is the job nature. Got it now I hope.
sgbabydoll
Active Member
Not every man can be a duck you know? Just like so many soccer players but not all are celebrities.
hello all,
thanks for all the comments!
what u all said basically tallies with what my husband tells me abt these places. he goes there mostly with his customers and ppl he needs to entertain. he doesnt choose where to go but basically follows where they choose to go. the reason why i want to know more was because i wanted to understand better how strong the temptations are in those places. i'm not too concerned that he goes there to FIND temptations, but since he mentioned that he was tempted at times, i felt compelled to understand the situation and the environment there so that i do not allow my imagination to go into overrun.
i guess i've just been living a very sheltered life. none of the ppl i know and hang out with would even know of such places. perhaps its the nature of the job and the environment. i could probably count the times i've been to a club on one one hand, and my experience with ktv is either kbox or partyworld.
as it is, my husband was only exposed to such after he started working at his current job around 3 years back. taking into account the things i mentioned in my earlier posts, i'm trying to rationalise why i feel just a tad edgy when he's out there with all the opportunities and the beautiful women whereas i'm at home alone with a growing tummy. i know this is called 'worrying for nothing'. its just like i've finished a beautiful puzzle, and i see a black speck on one of the pieces. it doesnt mar the beauty of the finished product, but i know its there. erm, get what i mean?
thanks for all the comments!
what u all said basically tallies with what my husband tells me abt these places. he goes there mostly with his customers and ppl he needs to entertain. he doesnt choose where to go but basically follows where they choose to go. the reason why i want to know more was because i wanted to understand better how strong the temptations are in those places. i'm not too concerned that he goes there to FIND temptations, but since he mentioned that he was tempted at times, i felt compelled to understand the situation and the environment there so that i do not allow my imagination to go into overrun.
i guess i've just been living a very sheltered life. none of the ppl i know and hang out with would even know of such places. perhaps its the nature of the job and the environment. i could probably count the times i've been to a club on one one hand, and my experience with ktv is either kbox or partyworld.
as it is, my husband was only exposed to such after he started working at his current job around 3 years back. taking into account the things i mentioned in my earlier posts, i'm trying to rationalise why i feel just a tad edgy when he's out there with all the opportunities and the beautiful women whereas i'm at home alone with a growing tummy. i know this is called 'worrying for nothing'. its just like i've finished a beautiful puzzle, and i see a black speck on one of the pieces. it doesnt mar the beauty of the finished product, but i know its there. erm, get what i mean?
sonypeh,
if one has never been to places portrayed on tv before, wouldn't it be natural to not know anything about it? given a choice i would certainly choose to visit those places myself and see for my own eyes before forming opinions. but i dont think its possible because
1.too expensive
2.no one i know would go with me
3.my husband will flip if he knew i went there
4.i think i'd stand out like a sore thumb with my huge tummy
5. the smoke's not good for my baby
and that's why i'm asking for objective views from ppl who might have been there. can't ask anyone i know because, again, no one i know has been there except my hubby.
hi doll and milo,
erm, actually i'm trying to understand what you guys are arguing about, but still quite unsure. are you two talking abt the same thing? or because u're talking abt different things that's why still no conclusion?
if one has never been to places portrayed on tv before, wouldn't it be natural to not know anything about it? given a choice i would certainly choose to visit those places myself and see for my own eyes before forming opinions. but i dont think its possible because
1.too expensive
2.no one i know would go with me
3.my husband will flip if he knew i went there
4.i think i'd stand out like a sore thumb with my huge tummy
5. the smoke's not good for my baby
and that's why i'm asking for objective views from ppl who might have been there. can't ask anyone i know because, again, no one i know has been there except my hubby.
hi doll and milo,
erm, actually i'm trying to understand what you guys are arguing about, but still quite unsure. are you two talking abt the same thing? or because u're talking abt different things that's why still no conclusion?
miloice
Well-Known Member
stardust, temptations are everywhere. Being in the sales line and having to go thr the entertainment daily is a career choice.
Think of it another way, your husband has probably enough exposure to be experienced to handle the temptations better.
There would always be people that would be more friendly. Some with ill intentions and others just socializing. Its really up to the him and how u guys manage the relationship and trust together. Nothing in this world is guaranteed.
Think of it another way, your husband has probably enough exposure to be experienced to handle the temptations better.
There would always be people that would be more friendly. Some with ill intentions and others just socializing. Its really up to the him and how u guys manage the relationship and trust together. Nothing in this world is guaranteed.
miloice
Well-Known Member
"Not every man can be a duck you know? Just like so many soccer players but not all are celebrities."
I agree man!!! So, u see, there is something positive from it. Those gals must be pretty and tactful enough to please their clients too! Why keep insisting negative connotations. LOL.
Oh man..... so what's the point again?? Getting way out. I thought you are talking about money despite my very strong attempts to clarify its about the client.
Forgive me dear teacher. I'm so bad with my words man. I beg you to let me take back everything said and please teach me how to phase it so politically correct that there isn't any negative connotations to be disputed on. You obviously know what I'm trying to say but chooses to drill on and on about the money thing. Honestly, I'm damn fed up. Despite pleading to direct the intended focus of the simple short sentence. Its still CONFUSING for you.
I agree man!!! So, u see, there is something positive from it. Those gals must be pretty and tactful enough to please their clients too! Why keep insisting negative connotations. LOL.
Oh man..... so what's the point again?? Getting way out. I thought you are talking about money despite my very strong attempts to clarify its about the client.
Forgive me dear teacher. I'm so bad with my words man. I beg you to let me take back everything said and please teach me how to phase it so politically correct that there isn't any negative connotations to be disputed on. You obviously know what I'm trying to say but chooses to drill on and on about the money thing. Honestly, I'm damn fed up. Despite pleading to direct the intended focus of the simple short sentence. Its still CONFUSING for you.
milo,
Not to add further to the argument but just a misconception for people not familiar with the modern vice industries with reference to what you written below:
"We are mostly in jobs for more than one single objective. Unlike jobs of vices. Its not something MOST people (this includes people in that service) willingly go into. There is little aspirations and career advancement in the profession unlike in a corporate. Many have their problems and difficulties. Which is why the single strong motivation for them is really money. Nothing really discriminating towards the gals. They wanted a better life or needed the money badly and fast and they worked hard for it still. "
Firstly, I do entertain quite a bit on/off and I am probably more in the know about the vice industries than the average joe.
Nowadays these girls are in the industries not just for "MONEY" - there are a lot of other factors. And you will be surprise that there are career aspirations - these girls want to do their own business to have their own girls to entertain clients.
Money is part of the equation but no longer the single overwhelming factor. Sexual pervasiveness is another factor. You will be surprised, for some girls if they can enjoy themselves and earn good money - why not?
Some of these girls told me:
"I like to meet people all the time. I like the excitement of having sex with different people. And on top of that, it pays really well"
Not to add further to the argument but just a misconception for people not familiar with the modern vice industries with reference to what you written below:
"We are mostly in jobs for more than one single objective. Unlike jobs of vices. Its not something MOST people (this includes people in that service) willingly go into. There is little aspirations and career advancement in the profession unlike in a corporate. Many have their problems and difficulties. Which is why the single strong motivation for them is really money. Nothing really discriminating towards the gals. They wanted a better life or needed the money badly and fast and they worked hard for it still. "
Firstly, I do entertain quite a bit on/off and I am probably more in the know about the vice industries than the average joe.
Nowadays these girls are in the industries not just for "MONEY" - there are a lot of other factors. And you will be surprise that there are career aspirations - these girls want to do their own business to have their own girls to entertain clients.
Money is part of the equation but no longer the single overwhelming factor. Sexual pervasiveness is another factor. You will be surprised, for some girls if they can enjoy themselves and earn good money - why not?
Some of these girls told me:
"I like to meet people all the time. I like the excitement of having sex with different people. And on top of that, it pays really well"
Milo,
"Places of vices, the gals are basically there for one objective. Money."
I think the argument is over this phrase - which I have mentioned may not be so true today as it was yesteryears.
Money is a consideration but not the only one and increasingly it is less important. you statement alluded to the fact that there is only one objective: Money.
Doll was trying to bring up this point as we are all also working for money and not much different from those girls..
To a certain extent I agree with her. In a way, when we go to work, we are exchanging our time for money. Our main motivation of going to work is for money - not much different from those girls of vices.
You seem to think that those girls going to work there has no job satisfaction other than money? Or they have no career aspirations?
"Places of vices, the gals are basically there for one objective. Money."
I think the argument is over this phrase - which I have mentioned may not be so true today as it was yesteryears.
Money is a consideration but not the only one and increasingly it is less important. you statement alluded to the fact that there is only one objective: Money.
Doll was trying to bring up this point as we are all also working for money and not much different from those girls..
To a certain extent I agree with her. In a way, when we go to work, we are exchanging our time for money. Our main motivation of going to work is for money - not much different from those girls of vices.
You seem to think that those girls going to work there has no job satisfaction other than money? Or they have no career aspirations?
milo,
yup, i do agree everything is up to the individual. just like you can be the only one in a whole group that doesn't smoke, but of course we have to agree too that its less likely for a person who is not brought up in a smoking family or and have friends who do not smoke to pick up smoking, and more likely for another person in the opposite situation to pick it up - peer pressure, curiosity and temptation.
bu of course i don't want to go headlong into the whole cycle of whatever i felt and thought in my earlier posts again lah.. i've gotten over that, and frankly, i feel that this episode has helped us grow closer and love deeper rather than apart. so that's one good thing. the bad thing is now that i've been awakened to the very real temptations of the outside world, i've got to learn to handle myself better in any other possible scenarios that may or may not come up in future. this may take a while though.. its not easy to have my lifelong beliefs and sheltered life turned inside out.
yup, i do agree everything is up to the individual. just like you can be the only one in a whole group that doesn't smoke, but of course we have to agree too that its less likely for a person who is not brought up in a smoking family or and have friends who do not smoke to pick up smoking, and more likely for another person in the opposite situation to pick it up - peer pressure, curiosity and temptation.
bu of course i don't want to go headlong into the whole cycle of whatever i felt and thought in my earlier posts again lah.. i've gotten over that, and frankly, i feel that this episode has helped us grow closer and love deeper rather than apart. so that's one good thing. the bad thing is now that i've been awakened to the very real temptations of the outside world, i've got to learn to handle myself better in any other possible scenarios that may or may not come up in future. this may take a while though.. its not easy to have my lifelong beliefs and sheltered life turned inside out.
miloice
Well-Known Member
sm, point taken.
All, please allow let me take back that statement about the money. I don't want to spend a great deal disputing on that because the whole purpose is really not on that. It is only to point out that its largely dependent on the client. The supply is readily available and the price is right.
So, please accept this clarification. Many thanks.
Sorry for the confusion caused. The frustration is mutual.
All, please allow let me take back that statement about the money. I don't want to spend a great deal disputing on that because the whole purpose is really not on that. It is only to point out that its largely dependent on the client. The supply is readily available and the price is right.
So, please accept this clarification. Many thanks.
Sorry for the confusion caused. The frustration is mutual.
sm,
that's precisely the type of girls i'm afraid that might try to hook up my husband. no matter how strong a control a person has, how morally upright,how much he loves his wife and family, and how unwilling he is, i'm pretty sure that drinking would start loosening some inhibitions. and topped up with such a woman, set on achieving her 'target', is practically an equation for disaster.
that's precisely the type of girls i'm afraid that might try to hook up my husband. no matter how strong a control a person has, how morally upright,how much he loves his wife and family, and how unwilling he is, i'm pretty sure that drinking would start loosening some inhibitions. and topped up with such a woman, set on achieving her 'target', is practically an equation for disaster.
miloice
Well-Known Member
stardust, again its about choices in life. He is indeed in a situation regularly that exposes him to this level of temptation. Unless he wants to switch his career and its financially feasible, else its a risk u guys needs to manage. No point being so worried.
Worrying does nothing at all.
Worrying does nothing at all.
sgbabydoll
Active Member
On my part there is no confusion nor frustration.
sgbabydoll
Active Member
Stardust, don't think a career switch out of sales is the answer you're seeking. If a man wants to stray, he can do so anywhere, not necessarily at "places of vice" and with KTV girls. Cliche this may sound but that's life. Have we not heard on the news that a 30-something teacher had had sex with her 15-year-old student. No where is really safe, not even on campus. So I won't call it a risk that your husband and you have to manage. It's something that every couple has to deal with regardless of occupation and places that they frequent.
sgbabydoll
Active Member
Milo, hard to follow does not mean I am confused. It means.....well, never mind.....I shall leave it as it is before you say I am picking on your language hehe
stardust,
I am not saying that men will or will not be tempted. Temptation is always there. Of course there are more temptation in the setting of ktvs/clubs.
However, the intention is more important. If the intention of your hb is clear and he is there to entertain, mostly he will keep his bearing right. There is no guarantee of course.
But if the intention of your hb is to have fun - then he does not need to go to that type of place.
I am not saying that men will or will not be tempted. Temptation is always there. Of course there are more temptation in the setting of ktvs/clubs.
However, the intention is more important. If the intention of your hb is clear and he is there to entertain, mostly he will keep his bearing right. There is no guarantee of course.
But if the intention of your hb is to have fun - then he does not need to go to that type of place.
stardust,
Another point to add. Since your hb has already been exposed for 3 years I would say that he has probably pass the danger stage.
To me, it is much more dangerous not having been exposed before and you are put in that kind of situation - you will be tempted more.
Since he has been exposed for 3 years, he has seen his fair share. If he was tempted before means it was already a done deal. If he has not been tempted then his chance of being tempted is lower now. If you believe that he has not been tempted, then you should have faith in him.
Another point to add. Since your hb has already been exposed for 3 years I would say that he has probably pass the danger stage.
To me, it is much more dangerous not having been exposed before and you are put in that kind of situation - you will be tempted more.
Since he has been exposed for 3 years, he has seen his fair share. If he was tempted before means it was already a done deal. If he has not been tempted then his chance of being tempted is lower now. If you believe that he has not been tempted, then you should have faith in him.
sgbabydoll
Active Member
Milo, I like to clarify once and for all that I commented on your comments to give another perspective on what has been posted. I believe I did not explicitly say that you are wrong or I am right. At times when I do not agree with you, I would put it as a question to further clarify on why you think like this or that. But I realise that comments on your comments do not seem to go down well with you. Sadly.
milo bro,
u misunderstood my post... it was meant to be a sharing of my honest-thoughts on this topic, that's why i said i am not gonna be politically-correct abt it - When i share the lessons i draw.
the lesson is - "many of these ladies are alot more passionate and entreprenial abt their lives, and definitely take more risks in building a future for themselves without the environment we've taken for granted (as sporeans)." AND "i dun see them any more different than our foremothers who came as samsui women leaving their country for an opportunity just to do better."
actually i foresaw where this whole discussion might go... that's why i posted what i posted as a thought - Before today's discussion. it's why i said i didn't wanna speak too much on this topic becos it's unlikely to change anything. it wasn't personal to u, but i'm saying "there are already pre-conceived notions etched in pple's minds." which the more i share, the more likely pple will expect me to Explain & Defend the ktv/ktv gals. i was Expecting tat from some lady forummer out of nowhere actually...
again i say "i do draw lessons". i just add that "end of the day, all of us work for money... regardless of how much we think we're different, we're all working for money... and this money Has a purpose."
u misunderstood my post... it was meant to be a sharing of my honest-thoughts on this topic, that's why i said i am not gonna be politically-correct abt it - When i share the lessons i draw.
the lesson is - "many of these ladies are alot more passionate and entreprenial abt their lives, and definitely take more risks in building a future for themselves without the environment we've taken for granted (as sporeans)." AND "i dun see them any more different than our foremothers who came as samsui women leaving their country for an opportunity just to do better."
actually i foresaw where this whole discussion might go... that's why i posted what i posted as a thought - Before today's discussion. it's why i said i didn't wanna speak too much on this topic becos it's unlikely to change anything. it wasn't personal to u, but i'm saying "there are already pre-conceived notions etched in pple's minds." which the more i share, the more likely pple will expect me to Explain & Defend the ktv/ktv gals. i was Expecting tat from some lady forummer out of nowhere actually...
again i say "i do draw lessons". i just add that "end of the day, all of us work for money... regardless of how much we think we're different, we're all working for money... and this money Has a purpose."
since already come this far... perhaps just add something more...
there's actually Much aspirations and entrepreneurship, which i can say is easily more than locals. there's no need for corporate 'career advancement' becos the minimum wage is already higher than the managerial positions that most pple are aiming to reach.
this is One thing i MUST touch on, being 'Powder' in this forum - and that is the misconception of 'Prospects'. alot of pple may have good prospects, but if One's idea of prospect if hitting the top position for a salary of 20-25k after climbing from 2-3k salaries, then i can tell u now - some hawkers, real estate agents, insurance agents, ktv gals, brokers, traders, consultants... all with No corporate setting - are already hitting that Top salary which some 'propsect-chasers' are hoping to achieve in 10 yr's time.
so really? what is the definition of prospects? should we feel good abt being calm on earning money? do we point at the desperate ones and think we're better than them? I mentioned in my initial post abt the lesson i draw - how lucky we are to be born in spore.
ps: pls note my interest is Always in dispelling pre-conceived notions that are misconceptions.
there's actually Much aspirations and entrepreneurship, which i can say is easily more than locals. there's no need for corporate 'career advancement' becos the minimum wage is already higher than the managerial positions that most pple are aiming to reach.
this is One thing i MUST touch on, being 'Powder' in this forum - and that is the misconception of 'Prospects'. alot of pple may have good prospects, but if One's idea of prospect if hitting the top position for a salary of 20-25k after climbing from 2-3k salaries, then i can tell u now - some hawkers, real estate agents, insurance agents, ktv gals, brokers, traders, consultants... all with No corporate setting - are already hitting that Top salary which some 'propsect-chasers' are hoping to achieve in 10 yr's time.
so really? what is the definition of prospects? should we feel good abt being calm on earning money? do we point at the desperate ones and think we're better than them? I mentioned in my initial post abt the lesson i draw - how lucky we are to be born in spore.
ps: pls note my interest is Always in dispelling pre-conceived notions that are misconceptions.
miloice
Well-Known Member
doll, its never about correctness lah. Call it careless use of words or something else. We are really advising TS about her concern. And I don't want to change the focus to become analyzing the wording. I have no intention to condemn or focus the discussion on the gals.
Hope this is clear.
Hope this is clear.
it's different cos they dun have the kind of governance and opportunities within their own country which we have... But there are good and bad reasons... the Chinese/Indians have been amongst the Firsts in seeking opportunities outside their country, whereas we dun really need to, as much as them. we can dream and realise our dreams without leaving the country.
Just for discussion. I know of a local girl - a prostitute if you want to call it crudely or a working lady to be nicer.
She is only mid 20s of age but she is much smarter and shrewd than many much older than her. She has been working in this line for 2 year plus and her original aim of paying for her 1st property has been fulfilled - and she is collecting rental. She enjoys meeting people but no she is not your typical "working lady". She don't work at night and will be home by 7pm. She has dinner with her family everyday. She don't work on weekends. She work-out religiously and maintain her beauty and her figure - enhance her value.
She don't see herself as sacrificing her body. She enjoys sex as much as a guy would enjoy. And to her, she gives herself another two years when she can get another property - then she can retire by 27/28 - get a 9 to 5 job and has two properties to her name and she can probably retire if she wants to.
I have not seen a more enterprising and smart young girl. She is by the way educated and not your ah lians. She reads widely and travel widely as well.
She knows what she wants and set out to achieve it and as I can see it, she will have her objective completed in 2 years time.
She is not someone hungry in that sense but someone who knows what she wants and focuses on achieving them.
Just to break some sterotyping of working lady.
She is only mid 20s of age but she is much smarter and shrewd than many much older than her. She has been working in this line for 2 year plus and her original aim of paying for her 1st property has been fulfilled - and she is collecting rental. She enjoys meeting people but no she is not your typical "working lady". She don't work at night and will be home by 7pm. She has dinner with her family everyday. She don't work on weekends. She work-out religiously and maintain her beauty and her figure - enhance her value.
She don't see herself as sacrificing her body. She enjoys sex as much as a guy would enjoy. And to her, she gives herself another two years when she can get another property - then she can retire by 27/28 - get a 9 to 5 job and has two properties to her name and she can probably retire if she wants to.
I have not seen a more enterprising and smart young girl. She is by the way educated and not your ah lians. She reads widely and travel widely as well.
She knows what she wants and set out to achieve it and as I can see it, she will have her objective completed in 2 years time.
She is not someone hungry in that sense but someone who knows what she wants and focuses on achieving them.
Just to break some sterotyping of working lady.
hello milo n doll,
it was never my intention nor have i ever thought as even asking him to switch his jobs.
he has a talent, if you will, in sales and i'm very certain he will never be happy anywhere else.
and milo, yes i agree, worrying doesnt help. but i must say i do wonder what he's doing when i know he's there. and one thing i can be happily rest assured of is he wouldn't lie to me about going to these places, unlike before, when he did not tell me where he went, and i too did not ask.
sm,
i'm pretty certain that he hasn't crossed the line, and i must say your theory makes perfectly good sense to me.
i'm sure there are many other women like this one you described. and that's why i've never judged them. each person lives according to his/her own code, and if anything were to really happen, the only person to blame would be the one putting his own happiness at risk just for one roll in the hay.
it was never my intention nor have i ever thought as even asking him to switch his jobs.
he has a talent, if you will, in sales and i'm very certain he will never be happy anywhere else.
and milo, yes i agree, worrying doesnt help. but i must say i do wonder what he's doing when i know he's there. and one thing i can be happily rest assured of is he wouldn't lie to me about going to these places, unlike before, when he did not tell me where he went, and i too did not ask.
sm,
i'm pretty certain that he hasn't crossed the line, and i must say your theory makes perfectly good sense to me.
i'm sure there are many other women like this one you described. and that's why i've never judged them. each person lives according to his/her own code, and if anything were to really happen, the only person to blame would be the one putting his own happiness at risk just for one roll in the hay.
miloice
Well-Known Member
Well, of cos there are different use cases. But, do they represent the majority?
Think we are talking in general and not specific use cases. Generally, foreigners hunger more for better lives. Singaporeans demand and expect good life. In my personal view, morals are eroding but everyone have the choice to live life their own ways and I'm not going to benchmark them. Be it because of difficulties or simply personal choices. Its their lives. Surely, most parents would be hurt to know what they do to achieve their dreams. For parents out there, honestly, u may respect their right to choose and lead their lives but deep down the hurt will be there.
Think we are talking in general and not specific use cases. Generally, foreigners hunger more for better lives. Singaporeans demand and expect good life. In my personal view, morals are eroding but everyone have the choice to live life their own ways and I'm not going to benchmark them. Be it because of difficulties or simply personal choices. Its their lives. Surely, most parents would be hurt to know what they do to achieve their dreams. For parents out there, honestly, u may respect their right to choose and lead their lives but deep down the hurt will be there.
hi milo,
actually i dont really think and then get more worried. its sort of a mindless wondering. in fact, he's there at one of the ktv i was asking about right now. i suppose i've reached a neutral point already, i cant say i'm totally nonchalant about it, but the best i can do as a wife is wonder about it, but not interfere or worry excessively for nothing.
actually i dont really think and then get more worried. its sort of a mindless wondering. in fact, he's there at one of the ktv i was asking about right now. i suppose i've reached a neutral point already, i cant say i'm totally nonchalant about it, but the best i can do as a wife is wonder about it, but not interfere or worry excessively for nothing.