What should I do? Divorce her or not? Please advice

"When I mentioned "but we are on topic of china women u see... " I was referring to yet another case of a guy getting conned by a china woman, not singaporeans or indians or whoever."

This is not just another case of being conned by Chinese woman. Just as if a Singaporean man cheated his wife we shouldn't condemn all men as being cheaters.

Yes, incidentally it may be a case of a PRC woman cheating a Singaporean guy - which isn't all so clear now. Even if it is, PRC chinese women are NOT ALL FIRE that will burn us.

I know a pretty large number of them. Mostly they are nice and sincere and they are damn bloody smart - I would say too smart for Singaporeans because they honed their survival skills due to the intense competition back home.

And there are many example of successful marriages to PRC women. And yes, they don't ALL CHEAT. Of course the not too successful marriages will be highlighted..

So while we are technically on a topic about PRC woman, we can well all do without the discrimination and the general statements about them. It is not constructive all all
 


haiz milo, i go to church not to marry those ppl there - what double standards?!! like this, you might as well say i take chopper go down orchard road and chop every china PRC i see - like this then i not practicising double standards?

Pls lah. i've already explained, i've already apologized, if it makes you feel very noble to keep harping on this instead of what my main point is and putting ppl down then be my guest lor....

Like you and everyone else, I have my own opinion I have my own say don't I?

And I really don't understand why you people cannot comment abt the point that I was trying to ut across instead of just harping on and on and on and on abt this discrimination thingy.

Please lah...spend the effort advising TS instead.
Goodness!
 
habe:

Your first post:

"please lah....hasn't there been just too many cases of such to even ring any warnings before you decide to marry a china woman.
wanna talk about LOVE with these scheming ppl? Please man..."

Please lah.. instead of making comments as above, why don't you spend the effort advising TS instead?

What has your point got to do with advising TS?

And yes, you can have your own opinion.. But can it stop us from commenting?

Goodness!
 
Habe, I have been advising the TS.

But, it was your defensive replies that kept coming back. no? It isn't just me that see the discriminating sweeping statements you made. It is never about feeling noble or anything. So... pls lah. We are discussing and disputing on whats written in the thread and not someone standing on high morals condemning another.
 
Sadman,

i seldom pm people I don't know online to share the idea of gathering together to see who and how is pitiful and dramatic. Really, it can get depressing pouring and listening to each other sad stories or worries. The only time I pm or call some personal friends are when I'm really hitting hard rock bottom. Needing someone I can trust to listen and advise me.

Rather, take the step to want to recover. The 1st step is tough but once you gain momentum, things will move on faster.

I don't claim to have rich experience in life. But its not a smooth ride. I'm what I'm today partially because of the problematic background I had. We cannot choose the situation we want to be in. We can only choose how to react to them. Positively or negatively. Self-pity, unwillingness to accept reality are all parts of coming to terms with the painful truth.

Its a walk everyone must go through no matter what unique circumstances we are facing.
 
Habe, does it mean that it's OK to discriminate against people we know we won't marry or befriend? I hope your answer is NO, but that would contradict what you have been saying here.
 
Milo, so am i suppose to keep quiet when unfair criticisms keep coming my way?

And frankly, I do not believe that I'm the only in this entire forum who have such views abt these "crows".

So yep, nobody's noble, everybody have free will of speech. If you comment, i will defend.
Thank you very much.

Doll, not very sure I understand your statement. If i were to discrimiate ppl i dun marry or dun befriend then perhaps i won't be going to my church anymore. by this church example i'm trying to show that i do not discrimiate the entire population of china ppl, only those socially tainting species i.e the crows.
Is that clear enough?
 
let's just end this hostility lah ok

I started it, so now i will call a stop to it.

I was wrong to bring up discrimination, my bad, but i'm just hoping that sadman will be wiser and heed warning signs when it comes to prevent future heartaches/agony be it marriage, friendship, money or whatever it is. same to everyone. that is my bottomline.

Ok that's it!!! FULL STOP!!
 
Habe, what I meant was going to a church with PRC Chinese and worshipping alongside them does not mean you do not hold any indiscriminating views of them, which is evident in what you have said here. I do not follow you when you said you are non-discriminating.
 
habe, did I ever said u are the only one that is discriminating?? My calls for everyone to look at the issue without discriminating wasn't directed at you only. Why not reread the posts again. You will realize the defensiveness started with you.

Its strange that you think you can write anything you like and want and then decide when who should reply or not. And you said you are prepared for disagreements "to be slam"? I reckon not.
 
frankly doll, if u want to go into what i think in my head, yes, i'll tell you that i do guard against them but if they speak to me or extend their hands out, i'll will still shake their hands and smile.

so now are you saying that non-discrimination means i should be jumping in joy to see them and i should go up and hug them when i see them? i dun even do so with my parents.

so how do you define non-discrimination?
From terrorism to civil wars, to discrimination articles and racist jokes on the internet, to ppl holding their noses when a certain foreign race/nationality walks by, to quietly and occassionally harbouring discriminatory thoughts...where do you want me to stand? If you expect non-discrimination to be totally pure even in thoughts at all times, then sorry lor, i'm not able to do that.
 
when did i ever dictate who should reply and who should not? i may say i'm ready to get slam but that doesn't equate to an INVITATION to get criticised unfairly. i already said - you comment i defend - is this a dictation?

reread WHAT posts? haven't i already admitted tat i started it and threw in white towel to surrender and ask for peace yet you still keep on whacking. wanna pin point every word that readers write and twist it round and round

seriously - milo, just what do you want? or do you actually enjoy arguing on this?
 
"so now are you saying that non-discrimination means i should be jumping in joy to see them and i should go up and hug them when i see them? i dun even do so with my parents."

I thought you were astute but you can't follow what I have said. I already said even if you are going to a church teeming with PRC Chinese and worshipping the same God as they do, it doesn't mean you do not discriminate against them. So, same goes with your "jumping in joy to see them and.....go up and hug them when you see them.....", it doesn't mean you embrace them. So, you should stop coming up with similarly crappy analogy.

How I tell you are indiscriminately discriminating is when you blamed others for destroying the social structure of the society you live in, without first examining how the structure was like before these people came in.
 
Refreshing your memory that is seemingly short term... Reread your reply today at 2:51 pm.

I don't enjoy arguing. You don't need to get personal with this kind of accusation. My point is simple, don't discriminate and bring a person's nationality into the picture. Is that so hard to comprehend? You got all defensive and thinking its unfairly targetting at you when my statement is really pleading for all to avoid discrimination.

the irony of it all... the more defensive you got, the more you reveal your discrimination. Everyone have their personal preferences, but we need to be sensitive and keep that in check instead of making such sweeping discriminating statements.

I repeat, go reread the messages. Be fair and objective. Am I trying to argue or did u keep coming back with excuses for yourself. Each time, making it even more messy? By pointing out the flaws, it has been perceived by you as like arguing.

Quote : "If you comment, i will defend.
Thank you very much."

If you defend with a flawed rational, I would comment. If you defend is a logical one, I would agree with you. I hope you are defending not because I comment but because things are flawed to you and you reply them with good reasons. Its not an attack, so there isn't defending to do really. Its an exchange and discussion no?

On the church going thing. Personally, thats the thing I strongly dislike about these 'fellowship'. Facing hundreds of people that pretends to be loving. For sure, there are the sincere ones. But many more like yourself, pretending to be loving but holding on to your discriminating views about them. Why does one get into such hypocritical fellowship regularly? Get real.
 
firstly, i do not appreciate ppl hitting me below the belt by saying things that suggest i'm STUPID just becos i do not follow what you say. similarly, u do not seem to follow what i say either. miscommunication/mis understanding of each other's point of view does not equate to anyone's being less "astute". if you like to know, i'm equally frustrated with everyone here misintepreting my comments as well but i dun go round calling ppl stupid and sick

Milo, you misinterprete what i deemed as a good gesture on my part to own up and resolve this arguement as trying to dictate what you should or should not comment.

"If you defend with a flawed rational, I would comment. If you defend is a logical one, I would agree with you. " you sound as if you shold be telling me whether my rational is flawed or not? and u telling me how i should word my defense? So i should be only putting in comments that you should agree with? what's the point of a forum then? what's the point of "discussing and disputing"?

For church, we go to church for worship, one hr service and we only have contact with one another for 1-2 minutes, sometimes none at all. aren't you being also discriminating agst religion, the way you comment abt church and fellowship? its seems that your idea of this discrimation is much worse than me.Church is a public place, anybody and everybody can go there to worship. at least i respect them as ppl who wants to have a place to worship. so in your opinion, what do you expect me to do? chase all the china ppl out from church? or maybe you would tell me not to go to church? I'm very clear what's my purpose of going to church, china ppl or anyone for that matter will not deter me from my faith.

and just what right do you have to call me hypocritical? You said you do not like to quarrel, so how is it that you will misinterprete my gesture to make peace as a dictation to control comments? You are so against racism and nationality discrimination, yet you decide to dislike a religion, calling us hypocritical. like wise - whatever your religion is(if u have one) - are you 100% sure everyone as your place of worship is sincere and not pretending to be loving?

We can go on and on Milo, if you insist.u think i'm not making sense, well, the feeling is mutual.just accept the fact that ppl have different opinions that do not require your agreement.
 
habe,

I do agree with Milo and doll that you are twisting your way out of here.

Firstly you obviously have some discrimination against China women and when that was pointed out.. your give some analogy.. which as rightly point out.. is a bad analogy

And then you want to end the argument (fine) with a last say. FULL STOP.

But as milo has pointed out.. you can't dictate that.. other still can comment... if you really don't like it.. you can FULL STOP yourself by not replying..

But if you still want to engage .. other people will continue to engage.. and it defeat the purpose of saying FULL STOP when you didn't really want to stop.
 
Note, I do not dislike the religion nor the church building. I only spoke against the so called regular fellowship with hypocrites that not only happen in church buildings asking them to share but then putting on tainted glasses in discriminating them.

In fact, I'm highly influenced by many teachings in the faith. The whole idea of protestians is to rebel against man made traditions and focus on the relationship with the creator. I truly believe in that. And not the ideas that pastors or any other people telling us. I search within for answers.

To all, worship whatever you believe. But please be true to yourself and crap the hypocritical bullshit. I truly give the benefit of the doubt to those sincere folks that they have found peace and truth with their creator.
 
oh and yes, dun try to command what i should do not do - telling me to reread my posts and that i have a seemingly short memory. you say i make sweeping discriminating statements, but why not do a self check on the type of degrading personal insults you hurl on ppl??
hypocritical, stupid, sick, short term memory, telling ppl to reread posts. have i done anything so wrong to deserve those comments? you can disagree with ppl's posts for all you want, but are all these name calling necessary?

pls show some respect.
 
Let me remind you.... If you do a search in this thread. This is the 1st time I even wrote the word "STUPID". It is you that used it thrice.

Asking someone to reread isn't saying that he/she is stupid...
I wrote : "I repeat, go reread the messages. Be fair and objective. Am I trying to argue or did u keep coming back with excuses for yourself. Each time, making it even more messy? By pointing out the flaws, it has been perceived by you as like arguing."

I pled for you to be fair and objective. NOTHING ABOUT STUPIDITY. Somehow, u went on to think its something about a person intelligence. I really have no idea why. Perhaps, as sm pointed out, u r trying to twist your way out.

Ok, u found my sarcasm about your memory in bad taste. I acknowledge that. But please then explain how could you claim you are not trying to shut others out with that post of yours?
 
Habe, u are so touchy abt name calling but u hv no qualms abt labelling china women as "black crows"? Not expecting u to get pally wif them. U dun hv to like them but at least give them enough respect not to judge them. Every relationship (whether wif china women or not) differs.
 
Habe,

to be fair, i don't think anyone has said the word stupid, other than you, or hurl any of thoes insults that you think they did.
 
And respect has to be earned.

I am not afraid to say I have no respect for what you have written.

And being discriminating is a personal thing. We are all to a certain extent.. we have our preferences.. but we don't use our discrimination as a point of reference for argument sake.. we use facts and logic to argue.
 
Well, Laundry, that's how she is demanding RESPECT. One way to her only but with her having no discretion nor sensitivity to blast with such discriminating manners.

Not to mention suggesting that I like to argue because I pointed out her contradictions in her reasons.
 
sm, sorry, just what am i trying to twist out of?
that i am discriminating? yes indeed i am and i have admitted that and made a public apology haven't I? since milo keep telling us to look at this matter without tinted glasses, so why are we blowing this up? isn't this abit ironic?
that on one hand, ppl are saying that we shold look at this objectively, so i apologise to clear up the mess and put things back on track, yet now i'm also getting the flak for this.

so me apologising - is now viewed as a cowardly act to squirm out of this? i see i see......
 
don't know which pot calling the kettle black..

You can talk about other people being scheming .. but now allowing other people to call you discriminating..
 
habe,

words of advice... If you want to walk away from an argument.. i have done it many times... just walk away.. don't look back.. don't have to bother what other people are writing..

don't have to apologize for your own views.
 
LOOK HERE Habe. U accused me :-
1) of liking to argue.
2) Calling you stupid when clearly you are ONLY ONE that used them before your claims.
3) Name calling.
And somehow I'm suppose to just agree to that?

I'm explaining to you and asking you to reread the posts objectively and fairly. Is this blowing it up? Its indeed very ironic.

Its so ironic that everyone else here seems to see the blaring points except you.
 
laundry - how else can i differentiate the type of scheming china women from the general crowd? i used black crows because i have heard this term in the society.

on "stupid" - doll has mentioned that "I thought you were astute but you can't follow what I have said" yes perhaps the exact word "stupid" was not spelt out, but this statement already suggested certain degree of stupidity isn't it?

ok trying to be fair and objective - how to do that when you all just refuse to let me just apologising and withdraw charges against my discriminatory statements?

so seriously, what do all of you want me to do now?
 
Milo, if you just kindly also reread your posts, perhaps you will be able to see just how many personal comments you made. just becos of one word out of the list i've mention that's not exactly being spelt out u keep harping on it. i accuse you? i dun think so.
 
Name one person in the forum that refused your apology. Note again, I was pointing out on how you attempt to shut others off with your post at 2.51pm.

Why don't I accuse you of all kind of stuffs and reply immediately that I'm sorry and FULL STOP? Seriously, did you look beyond your own personal perspective in this entire discussion?
 
thanks sm.


if my discrimnatory remarks are offensive - i have apologised.

i tried to explain that what i was trying to say is that i find it strange that ppl kept on getting themselves upset despite warning signals(and that "black crows" are one of such warning signals) but somehow the message did not get through

the arguement became heated and not objective becos of this, i apologies and tried to make peace but apparantly redundant.

I will leave this thread as sm has adviced.

All the best to you sadman.

but i hope you guys will not discriminate me in other threads just becos of this.

have a nice day
 
There is no need for u to play judge and differentiate scheming china women from the general crowd in the 1st place. Even if they are exploiting a weakness in our social fabric, why do we allow the weakness in the 1st place? There are 2 sides to every coin.

In any case, does black crow sound like it has positive connotations? Dun parrot wat others use wifout considering the repercussions.
 
Laundry,

it reminds me on how singaporeans resent foreign workers in all our blue collar employment but at the same time expect to pay a minimum for services. The Serangoon Gardens incident is one clear example.

The only way to keep costs low will be employing from the global competitive market. With it, so will the social issues from the foreign influx. This is a global thrend and not specific to singapore only. We allow the weakness because we needed it to keep our economy going. Not much Singaporeans are willing to clean our toilets, tables, clear the rubbish, sweep the floor and keep our basic services going at low cost. In most of our hospitals, the nurses and staffs are mostly foreign. At homes, almost our maids are foreign too. The hairdressers in saloons in HDB are also foreigners. They are everywhere. Like it or not, our society has changed.

So, we need to adapt with it and not resent changes.
 
Then we shut our little island away from the world lor. See how long we can survive. The irony is tat S'pore's success is built on our openness to globalisation. Yet, we're resenting their presence now.
 
hmm... let's put things into perspective...

1) those who have met, mingled and had more than just a simple conversation with PRC gals 19-29 put up your hands pls...

2) those who have more than 10 such regular frens, frens u can do coffee with... put up your hands pls...

ok, how many pple left here who can claim to really KNOW them?

even i dun dare to claim... hmm. so i guess that 90% of opinions and viewpoints on prc-gals are from... papers? sensationalised stories? hearsay from so-and-so?

it's nice to put things into perspective.

local guys are rather weak... fall quite easily to the few bad hats... and being sporean - they dun blame themselves, they will make the prc-gal they married out to be this big bad wolf... obviously the papers will buy it, why not? so will readers... who will share the stories... then to make a conversation, pple will share the stories they heard from 3rd party/4th party accounts...

local women do have stories, but unless it's really sensational like teachers n student... it's unlikely to happen cos it's just another divorce or separation... nothing spectacular cos it's something we know is happening anyway...

nope, a good story much include deceit, foreign, sex, highly sought-after pr-status, illicit affairs and a victim.

then we all just point fingers together... it's really quite fun!

i love S'pore... but i think some sporeans are too proud of our spore-branding to the point of being elitist... working amongst pr-chinese and going to places they go does not take away our prejudice... Why identify with them thru common places we go... shouldn't it be thru frenships with them?

it's abit lame... it's like when we say, "my best fren knows Jamie Yeo"... doesn't make u a fren of Jamie Yeo, does it? but sporeans just love these 3rd party associations whenever it adds some form of credibility to their arguments.

if your knowledge of pr-chinese, bangladeshis, indian-nationals, eastern europeans, vietnamese etc etc is limited to nothing more than just 3rd party information... and u speak like u Know them... u gotta seriously look in the mirror.

this isn't meant for Habe, it's meant to be a general read for those who are inclined to have prejudices...
 
Hey powder,

I have alot of china frds. (Both point 1 and point 2) cos i used to work in factory. 'Most' of them are friendly and nice. Not here to con ppl.
 
oui bluemoon,

did u put up your hands first?....before u typed?
happy.gif
 
Not to mention colleagues that I worked with in Beijing. They are friendly and hospitable. Sad thing in sgp culture. No one really bothers to bring our guest colleagues out after office hours. Unless, boss is paying for the dinner. This is what I observed within my office at least.

I'm guilty of it myself. We are so busy at night spending time with family and everything else but being a good host to our visitors.
 
Oh ya, 4got.. sorry.. 'Raise up hand'

some of them are my good friends cum ex.colleagues.

To me, I think not abt nationality, is abt moral values..
 
"To me, I think not abt nationality, is abt moral values.."

Wah. Peeper summarised so nicely into 1 statement & we had to talk until the cows come home.
 
Habe, I think it's either you stick to your apology and stop perpetuating in your discriminatory remarks, or simply stop apologising and continue in that antics. It's absolutely contradictory, so as your analogy, your shouting FULL STOP and how you developed your argument. It's like I stab you with a knife, I know it's wrong, I say sorry to you but I continue with my stabbing. Hence, my observation that you are non-astute, because you're pure show of emotions, wave after wave.
 
Talking about moral values, it is an individual conviction. No point looking at it at the national or domestic (family) levels.
 
guess it's understandable in terms of the prejudice... seriously our papers have their part to play too... and locally we buy into these stories quite easily...
 
Hi! Why is it that my thread has become a sea of debate of Chinese Nationals?

Anyway, I may still be getting another foreigner next time. Who knows ...

Anyway, thanks to all who have shown concerns and have given comments on their point of views and also those who have advised me.
I'm still not too sure as to what I should do. But I think road ahead will get clearer and things will get straighten up gradually.
 
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