Catholic Brides

knowsy

New Member
Be enlightened. Get informed.

Worth-less
About 130 million carats (26,000 kg) are mined annually, with a total value of nearly USD $9 billion. Now if you do the math - that works out to be US$69.20 per carat! The prices of diamond is artificially controlled and inflated. Mined diamonds are bought by cartels and kept in vaults to control supply and keep prices high, in truth there is nothing rare or precious about the stones.

For a detailed exposé of the De Beers cartel, read this article by Edward Jay Epstein in the February 1982 issue of The Atlantic Monthly - www.theatlantic.com/doc/print/198202/diamond

Have you heard of conflict diamonds?
Roughly 49% of diamonds originate from central and southern Africa - that's the majority of diamonds in retail. But this is the same region where conflict diamonds get worked into the system.

A conflict diamond (also called a blood diamond or a war diamond) is a diamond mined in a war zone and sold, usually clandestinely, in order to finance an insurgent or invading army's war efforts - http://www.amnestyusa.org/diamonds/index.do

In some cases, the United Nations has prohibited the export of conflict diamonds, arguing that their trade finances armies in fighting against legitimate governments and perpetrating human rights abuses, and prolongs devastating wars. It points to the UNITA rebels in Angola and to the Revolutionary United Front rebels in Sierra Leone (who it states were financed by the government of Liberia, also through diamond sales) as purveyors of conflict diamonds.

The UN is attempting to implement certification procedures to decrease the number of illicit diamonds on the world market. On July 19, 2000, the World Diamond Council adopted at Antwerp a resolution to strengthen the diamond industry's ability to block sales of conflict diamonds.

In 2002, the UN approved the Kimberley Process scheme aimed at preventing conflict diamonds entering the market.
See - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kimberley_Process

Still there is no guarantee the Kimberly Process can enforce 100% that no conflict diamonds make it to the market - see National Geogrpahic interview with reporter Dominic Cunningham - http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2003/02/0212_030212_diamonds.html

Natural mined diamonds have been coming under a lot of heat recently. Award-winning journalist Cecil Adams sums it up the best in a recent article: “diamonds are a scam, pure and simple.†Most people in the new millennium understand that between the DeBeers diamond cartel, the issue of child labor in Third World diamond processing operations, and “blood diamonds†used to finance oppression and genocide in Third World African countries, not to mention your snooty and pretentious local jeweler, diamonds are just not worth the hassle, guilt, and let’s not forget thousands and thousands of questionably spent dollars.


7 Reasons Why You Should NEVER Buy a Diamond:

1. The price of diamonds has been artificially inflated since the 1880's via the De Beers diamond cartel. Read this article by Edward Jay Epstein in the February 1982 issue of The Atlantic Monthly - www.theatlantic.com/doc/print/198202/diamond

2. Current public perception of diamonds is the direct result of a masterfully executed marketing campaign by De Beers that began in 1938, not inherent scarcity or value. If you've read the article by Edward Epstein (you really should), you know all of the gory details. Isn't it amazing (and scary) how brainwashed people are about the "value" of diamonds, even though they're not actually worth that much?

3. A diamond is an illiquid asset, not an "investment". Try to sell a second-hand diamond ring on eBay or at a pawn shop. Do you really think you'll get anything close to what you paid for it? Do you really think the price of any diamond you purchase today is going to go up significantly over time? Why do you think a diamond is forever? Because once you buy it, it's a 'lost' investment and you have no choice but to hold on to it. LOVE is forever but a diamond is for NEVER (if you know better).

4. The diamond industry funds warfare, genocide, and terrorism. A conflict diamond (also called a blood diamond or a war diamond) is a diamond mined in a war zone and sold, usually clandestinely, in order to finance an insurgent or invading army's war efforts. Profits from conflict diamonds are used to finance warlords in Angola, Sierra Leone, and Liberia, who use their weapons to kill and maim innocent people. You won't be able to tell if your diamond is a conflict diamond or not?
Read BBC reports
- http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/correspondent/1604165.stm
- http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/3581799.stm

5. A diamond is - by nature - just a pretty rock. Think of the oft-quoted "rule" of diamond ring buying: the ring should cost a minimum of two month's salary (pre-tax), and you should spend as much on a ring as you can afford. Let's put this rule in its proper context: according to the people who sell pretty rocks, you're supposed to trade a full two months of your time and effort for one of their pretty rocks. Does that seem wise?

6. People notice the setting more than the diamond itself. To the naked human eye, most decent quality diamonds look the same. Unless the stone is yellow, has major inclusions, or has a distinctly lopsided cut, no one will be able to distinguish an ideal cut, E color, VS-1 stone from a lesser-quality diamond just by looking at it. What people do notice is the setting - how the stone is featured or placed, side stones, and the craftsmanship and artistry of the band. Knowing this - does it make more sense to focus your attention and dollars on a better stone, or on a better setting?

7. The opportunity cost of buying a diamond is huge. Opportunity cost is what you give up by spending your scarce resources on a single option. In other words, if you drop ten grand on a diamond ring, you have $10,000 less to spend on other things, like a fantastic honeymoon, a car, furniture, a down payment on a house, investing for the future, or further education. Are all of these options worth giving up for a little piece of colorless carbon?

More readings...

Not Forever
The death of South African diamond magnate Harry Oppenheimer might mark the end of global domination for one of the world's most infamous cartels.
By Susan Emerling
http://www.salon.com/business/feature/2000/09/27/diamonds/index.html

Nice ice
Lab-made diamonds are as dazzling as those mined by third-world labor. This bling may be easier on your conscience -- and your wallet.
By Corrie Pikul
http://www.salon.com/mwt/the_big_idea/2004/12/24/diamonds/index.html

What you can do?
http://www.globalwitness.org/pages/en/what_you_can_do.html
 


jen02

New Member
Thks Lyon,
The website really useful. Learn alot too, but seems some way is not the way as in SG. Now am attending RCIA and we can borrow the Masses back home. So at least i can see and copy. Hehe.

Girls,
Sorry some questions.
For the Bridal Procession, we can use any song or need to use Cathoilc Hymn? For the Hymn what can we use? Must we go and find our choir and ask them?
 

lyons

New Member
<font color="119911">hi haze, yup, the website cannot follow word for word. but the readings at least they give you choices to select from so it's ok
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As for bridal procession, i think it depends a lot on the priest. Get him to allow the song and it should be ok. Well... i don't think you need a catholic hymn cos i've been to so many weddings where they used commercial songs like josh groban type of songs and pachelbel</font>
 

richelle

New Member
minssy

haha! now, I only have my bridal shop settle the rest still KIV.

Still looking for,

PG/VG
Cards
Favours
Caterer

not sure if I miss out anything
Do update me if you have any recommadation.
 

richelle

New Member
Hi Minssy

Thanks! You're really a great help!

Do you have any recommadation for those?

I'm trying to fine tune my caterer list now which I think it's more important
 

minssy

New Member
hi richelle,

welcome.

IMO, caterer is not and should not be the main thing. the main thing is how u do your mass booklet.. there are soooo many caterers out there and you can only choose 1. so u can go by the tried and taested or recommened by word of mouth.
 

lyons

New Member
<font color="119911">hi minssy, can I ask you, I'm doing up my mass booklet now and I'm not sure about certain things.

1. am i supposed to include the eucharistic prayer as per the normal masses in? i'm having a mass instead of a service.

2. i read somewhere that the lighting of unity candles is not preferred in catholic masses, is that true?

thanks!</font>
 

minssy

New Member
hi bride,

1) yes i would say. the liturgy of the eucharist will include the below:
Presentation of Gifts (Musical selection usually sung by cantor)
Eucharistic Prayer
Sanctus (Holy, Holy - usually sung)
Memorial Acclamation (usually sung)
Great Amen (usually sung)
Communion Rite
Lords Prayer
Nuptial Blessing
Sign of Peace
Agnes Dei (Lamb of God - usually sung)
Communion Hymn - Musical selection usually sung by cantor)

2) most priest do not practice lighting of unity candles now but some priest are ok with it. so, it depends on your priest. u gotta call him and check.
 

lyons

New Member
<font color="119911">thanks minssy! so the only thing in in addition to the normal mass proceedings is the nuptial blessing right?</font>
 

purpleclouds

New Member
hi all,

just wanna check as my church secretary emailed back saying that now we have to produce an UPDATED baptismal certificate, the birth baptismal cert can't be used. She told us to go to the parish and ask for a copy of your certificate. I'm confused. Can someone clarify?
 

minssy

New Member
hi purpleclouds,

yes. the baptism cert must be dated at least 6 mths before your AD.. that means, if your AD is in September, you can go to the church that you were baptised in MARCH to collect the baptism cert. then u produce this copy to the priest when u meet him for the pre-nuptial. the whole idea is that your wedding will then be recognised by the catholic church..
 

kitty_li

Active Member
Hi Bride,

yup...most priests prefer not to have the lighting of the unity candle nowadays...coz the thinking is that the essence of the wedding mass is the Rite of Marriage itself - the vows, the exchange of rings and the blessing. The thinking is that since the lighting of the unity candle was never part of liturgy, it 'distracts' the couple from the essential bits of the wedding mass...

Hi purpleclouds,
Yap, you'll need to get an updated baptism cert - or rather, an extract of it. The extract will indicate when and where you were baptised and confirmed, and there will be blanks for when and where you were married. So I suppose, if someone were to "bluff" and try to get married in the church a 2nd time, the updated cert will reflect it...
 
Hi gals,

Does anybody know how the mass starts? The priest leads the bride and her father in while the groom waits in front of the altar?

Thinking of the march-in song... anybody have any suggestions?
 

kitty_li

Active Member
hi bbp,
I think for that part, you may want to check with your priest and probably your preference. Coz I've seen wedding masses, where the priest leads the bride and her father, while the groom is in front. Though, most of the time, the priest will enter from the sacristry (behind the altar) by himself, and the bride and father march-in on their own...

Songs...Canon in D? There are a few variations floating ard in the Net.
 

minssy

New Member
hi bbp,

the latter that csi fan mentioned could be more common.. that means you march in with your dad.. if you have flower girls &amp; page boys, they will go first, then your bridesmaid, followed by you &amp; your dad..
 

jklim4642

New Member
bbq, my march in song was "WEDDING MARCH BY WAGNER"... i find canon in D too common... almost every church wedding will hear..
 

lyons

New Member
<font color="119911">hi bbp, i, on the contrary, think canon in D is everlasting. There is a reason why it's used in every church wedding
happy.gif
I'm considering using that.</font>
 
Thanks for the suggestions. I kinda agree with both of you. Canon in D is a nice everlasting song but it has become too common. In constrast, the Wedding March is no longer as common, <u>but</u> I don't like the song. Now thinking if I can break out of the trend and choose another classical piece I like.

So this song will be played at the start when dad and me walks in?
 

lyons

New Member
<font color="119911">hi bbp, i was thinking of celine dion's "the prayer" sung with andre bocelli (the suprano, forgot the spelling of his name). It's not bad</font>
 

jen02

New Member
Hi BBP,
Maybe u can use the song butterfly kisses by Bob Carlisle. A very nice song abt Father seening her daughter into the church.
 

jen02

New Member
Tot that Celine Dion and Canon in D also consider commercial songs. I tink for the bride march in can use any song but not for the entrance hymn. Maybe u can ask ur priest abt it.

Girl,
I have almost settle my mass booklet. As i have some question. As my wedding is on the Advent. Heard from my priest saying sometime in Mass order there no Gloria on Advent. Sld i put Gloria into my mass booklet? How abt the Creeds? Sld i add those 2 into my mass booklet? Thks alot!!
 

lyons

New Member
<font color="119911">hi bbp, i think it depends on what type of commercial songs you want to use. It all depends on the priest, actually. Some very chin chye then can. But some very particular. So best is ask your parish priest if it's allowed.

Hi Haze, I think for advent, there should be no gloria. But I'm not sure about creeds. I read somewhere that creeds are not included in wedding masses anyway. So probably don't have to put 2 of them in the mass booklet. But then again, I'm no expert so it might be best to confirm with your priest.</font>
 

purpleclouds

New Member
minssy, CSI Fan: so what i have to do is to go back to church where i was baptised and just tell them i need an updated baptism cert?

my AD is in Mar 08,counting 6 mths back,so in Sept 07 then i can get ask for the updated baptism cert? or can i ask for it now?
 

jen02

New Member
Lyon,
Thks alot. Will ask my priest abt it. =D

For the church hymn sld i use any song i like or consult the choir?
 

lyons

New Member
<font color="119911">hi Haze, some hymns cannot be used for weddings so if you're not too sure, you can consult the hymn books
happy.gif
or you can ask your choir also.</font>
 

lyons

New Member
<font color="119911">hey minssy and CSI, so happy, I just confirmed my church choir
happy.gif
The youth choir cannot make it cos it's their O and A levels perios (yah hor, I didn't think of that) so I approached Trevor. He's a really good soloist.

But now need your advice. I have a choice to get him alone to sing or him to lead with his choir. Which do you think is better? The price is just $200 more for the choir but it will fill the church with more voices? Or is a soloist better? What do you think?</font>
 
Hi bride,

Just my two-cents worth (although I'm not minssy or CSI, heehee). I remembered you have already set aside some money for the choir initially right? I feel that the choir will be much better because as long as you have non-catholics joining your wedding, the singing will not be as "together" as a usual sunday mass. Can't be helped. So I feel, if you have the budget for a choir, go for it!
 

minssy

New Member
hi bride,

in my opinion, its ok to have a soloist.. cos he will surely have a mike and his singing can fill the atmosphere...
happy.gif


for my wedding of less than 100 guests on a weekday, i had a soloist and his singing alone was powerful enough for the whole chapel... its really ok one
happy.gif
 

lyons

New Member
<font color="119911">wah thanks bbp and minssy! You two have given me good points to consider. Alamak, headache la. I should be having about 250 guests for the church ceremony with about 1/2 non-christians. That's why like what bbp said I'm worried. But then like minssy said, the soloist's voice is powerful enough to fill the church. dilemma dilemma
happy.gif


I'll go for the mass to hear the choir sing first. If nice, then I'll consider them cos I've only heard trevor sing.</font>
 
Hi bride,

Haha. Isn't it ultra tough when you get 2 completely differing opinions? Well, do keep us posted on your soloist/choir outcome. Cheers!
 

kitty_li

Active Member
hi ladies,
haiz...so busy at work lately that I didn't come by here...

well bride, to add to your dilemma (heehee), I like a full choir...coz I like the rich sounds of a full choir. More voices, more rich...and can do parts (SATB) and choral pieces. That's me lah. heehee...(that's why, when one of my friends volunteered to do soloist for my AD, his wife actually said 'eh, you sure or not? her expectations very high one leh...' hahaha.)
 

lyons

New Member
<font color="119911">haha thanks girls for your points of view! Will let you know after sunday whether i chose the soloist or the choir
happy.gif
</font>
 

bebegalgal

New Member
My FH is a roman catholic and i was a free thinker. We agreed not to hold our wedding in church instead we prefer to hold it in hotel. Can anyone help to advice whether can we invite the father to the hotel to do the blessing?
 

jklim4642

New Member
bebe, u can do that if your priest is willing to do it &amp; as long he is a registered soleminier from ROM... that is solely on personal grds. fyi, our priest did it for one couple on such matter last dec..
 

minssy

New Member
hi bebe,

nope... they normally dun go it.. but if you have very special reasons, you gotta speak to the priest personally..
 

lyons

New Member
<font color="119911">hi bebe, from what I know, for a marriage to be recognised by the catholic church, it must be celebrated in a catholic church but you can check with your priest on this.</font>
 

kitty_li

Active Member
hi minssy! *waves hard*...hahaha....

Sorry manz, I've been so busy the past few weeks. This is the busiest time at work...and it happens to be CNY. heehee... 1st CNY as a married person. Pockets really painful. muahahahaha...but it's quite fun attempting to deco the house for CNY. hehs...

Hi bebe, I think as a blessing...perhaps. but like they all say, better to check with the priest on this. Coz once it is out of church grounds, I don't think it is a sacrament anymore, and no rite of marriage. And Marriage is one of the 7 Sacraments for Catholics (unless of course, the catholic chooses to be priest/nun/religious brother or sister). Best is still to check with the priest(s) lah.
happy.gif
 

sea_blue

New Member
Hi Bebe, I went to ask the priest about whether the mass/service can be held in a chapel outside the church grounds too. And the answer I got is no. It has to be celebrated within the church premises so that it can be recognised by the church and recorded in the church registrar.
 

jklim4642

New Member
btw, bebe has mentioned that she is not having a church wedding. so that means she is not having a mass/service,or a sacrament or rite of marriage. so she is asking if the priest can soleminise the wedding for them &amp; at the same time to give them his blessing. i thought she is very clear abt that? *shrug*

like what i mentioned, this is then a personal thing b'coz if the priest is a soleminiser recognised by ROM, he can soleminise a marriage anywhere. if it is outside church compounds, then is not a catholic wedding anymore &amp; will not be recognised by the catholic communion. h/w it is still a recognised marriage in the eye of the law.

so, bebe, ultimately if the priest is also a personal friend of your HB, he may do you 2 this favour. rather than u get a soleminser who u 2 completely dunno.. so, at the end of the day, ask the priest.
 


kitty_li

Active Member
Hey Bebe, for such matters, it is best to consult a priest. Over here at this forum, we can only share with everyone what we have seen, what we have heard or our opinions. It is important to remember that what we mention over here should always be confirmed by the relevant authorities (unless an authority posts here lah...hehs).
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While not every Catholic will receive all 7 sacraments, I guess, non-Catholic spouses should bear in mind, the importance of the Sacraments for their Catholic spouses. (I'm not targeting anyone, but these are just my thoughts. I mean, if I marry a Bhuddist &amp; I know that certain rites or things are mearningful/good for him, I would want him to have it.) Whether to receive the Sacrament of Marriage or not is entirely up to the couple. So, in that respect, would a priest (the one who administers all the Sacraments) then want to solemnise a marriage outside the scantity of the church? As a favour or not, no idea. There may be some compelling reasons for celebrating mass/service outside church. I really don't know, but these are just my thoughts.
happy.gif


Like I mentioned earlier, perhaps, as a blessing - like say, after JP finishes pronouncing u guys as man and wife, and priest comes up to say a prayer of blessing (like how we say grace over the food before we eat)...perhaps it can be done.

Like diamond (and everyone else) says, ask the priest.
happy.gif
 

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