What should I do?

jamie1712

New Member
Dear all,
I am right now at the cross-road and I really dont know what to do.
I am in my late 20s, non-Singaporean, working as senior executive level in a good company, earning comfortable income, not enough to buy a house but enough to cover my needs.My current bf is in his late 30s, Singaporean, having a successful career, earning 6 figures, has his own decent apartment and a flashy car.
We know each other thru friends. I have never been a fan of his look or his wealth so I always kinda ignore him. That must have attracted him and for me, I am impressed by his wit. 4 months after we first met, we officially dated each other. Throughout the course of the dating, he would pay for food when we are out to eat ( 90% food court and 10% restaurant), I will pay for groceries that I bought for home cook food ( i love to cook at home). Throughout the relationship the only expensive gift that he gave me was a branded wallet ( less than 600) for my birthday. For his birthday, I also spend equivalent amount of money. So sorry for ranting on this, I just want to share that..not even once during the relationship that i expect any monetary benefit out of him. We never talked about our financial position. I did share with him how much I earn but he didnt want to disclose his income to me. Well, who care...i thought to myself.
10 months in the relationship, I found out that I was pregnant. As my period has been hay wired all the times, he has always said (maybe jokingly) he longs to be a dad and he really wants to settle down. When I broke the news to him, I actually gave him a choice of a wedding or others as I know 1 year is such a short period for us and I dont want to force him into anything. He actually agreed to a wedding. A month after my pregnancy, things are still great between us till his family steps in. His mother was interrogating me about my bank account saving during dinner. I told her that i dont have enough saving to buy a house now cos I have been supporting my lil bro study overseas and my parents but i ensure her that now that my bro is year 3 in university, he is capable of earning money on his own to support himself. For my parents, I used to give them about 20-30k per year ( this amount inclusive my bro study expense) but if I am having my own family here in Singapore, I would give them maybe a token amount of 5k per year. My parents will understand and they have never asked money from me ever. just that I feel it is my duty to support them. My bf parents dont seem to be pleased with my answers.
What makes me a filial daughter has rendered my family to be a possible liability to my bf and his family.They were so scared that one fine day, my parents will have cancer and I will demand money from my husband to save them. I quoted what my bf said to me " I cant spend my hard earned money on strangers" I choked on my tears when saying that "my family wants nothing from you"

We had a small wedding celebration in my country. My bf and his parents attended. They saw my house, knew that I didnt come from a poor family but they didnt let the matter rest. Shortly after that, my bf demanded a pre-up to be signed before our marriage. I fought against this hard..because I believed in love...not in money. My Bf went on and on pressuring me that if i dont want his money, why i dont agree to a pre-up. He said a pre-up will bring him a peace of mind, will help our relationship better, without a pre-up, he wont marry me. He even agrees to abortion if I dont sign pre-up.
I cried myself to sleep for three nights and decided for the sake of my baby, i will sign a preup. I even told him that a pre-up is not legalised in Singapore, court will have the final say so if you want to protect your asset you should set up a trust with sole beneficiary is your name. He kept silent.
For the baby, I forgave him and try to continue our relationship like nothing has ever happened.On and off, he will pressure me about how our child will get disadvantage ( if a gal) as her mother is not affiliated member of any primary school or when his friend whom i have never met, think of me as some kind of terrible, money sucker foreigner woman that Singaporean woman will lose out to. I just cried, brushed it off and think tomorrow will be a new day.

I thought...everything will be fine as long as i keep the faith...And one day he told me he too lazy to draft the pre-up and we dont need one. I said sure..and thought my prayers were answered.

One Sunday morning, he was busy searching house moving date on this ipad. We are staying in his private apartment ( 3 bedrooms) and he told me that he thinks it is too small with a maid and a baby on the way so he has been actively searching for house. I was quite touched by his care then. But our wedding will be held in 2 weeks, he has not even bought me an engagement ring ( he claimed he too busy with the wedding) but he has the time to move house? When I asked him why all of a sudden, he replied that owner may give a discount of 100 bucks if moving in earlier. I initially planned to move in after our wedding, "so what is 2400 bucks saving ( 2 year lease) comparing to 1 month rental (almost 5k)"-I told him..I didnt understand any of it and asked him why he didnt discuss with me. He said as he paid for the house and arranged for mover, I would not need to lift a finger,so I should not care so much.
I was puzzled. I knew something was not right but he refused to tell me. As a last resort, I told him if he didnt tell me the truth I will move out and leave him. Only then did I find out, his parents dont want me to stay in the property after marriage because the house may be considered matrimonial property and in the case of divorce, I maybe able to claim a share of the house. My heart stopped for a bit. I realized now the reason why he doesnt need a pre-up because its content is highly debatable and all his care for my child and my well-being was fake. It was just because he wanted to get my ass out of the house.
I was crying a river again. I was helpless and alone. I didnt dare to tell my parents because I scared this would hurt them even more.
He was saying that nobody from his family is out to harm me. Why did I agree to a pre-up yet make such a big fuss about moving out? What do I have to hide?
I went on and on explaining the hurt that he has brought on me. It is simply as if you were cut by a knife before a week ago and now you are cut again. It doesnt matter whether the wound is the same, the knife is the same, the position of the cut is the same, it still hurts!
I thought I have agreed to the Ultimatum and I can go on live my life peacefully but no...now I have to move house within a week..I really dont know what else will happen in the future.

I packed my things at his house. I have left the house and staying with my friend now.I have talked to him today but to him, I am just blowing the matter out of its portion. "It is just a small matter anyway"
I dont know what should I do now.
Should I have an abortion and kill an innocent life?
Should I put my baby for adoption so that there will be couples to love him or her
Should I just suck it up for my baby sake? just make a sacrifice to enter in something that already broke my heart?
Please help me...
 


60secs

Member
From what i guess, his parents or even himself are hoping you'll go for an abortion soon.
His actions shows that he doesn't love u anymore or if there's any love in the first place to being with.

Option 1: Give birth and the courts will grant you a sizeable amount of ailmony every month even if you 2 are not married and give them their worse nightmare.

Option 2: If u still value your singlehood, abort and they'll thank god for that.
 

powder

Active Member
james,

his wealth seems to be affecting u more than it affects him. The law in spore is rather disadvantageous to the men, as such... it natural that some would want to factor in a defence against parts of the law which they feel is Unfair... and there is no better time than prior to marriage.

if it were the other way around... u are some mega rich in Your country, the law in your country protects him and gives him the chance to contest Half of what's yours, and possibly the million dollar House that your parents buy for u as a matrimonial home.... maybe it won't be as harsh as u think it is.

no doubt Love is this and that... but as a parent if u were to approve of a Child's relationship... surely for Your wealth, u'd consider protecting your OTHER children's share of the asset, or the Charity organizations which u might wanna leave your money to... etc etc.

they have every right to be safeguarding Their money, even from their son... does he have a choice? NO, Not really... but u made it His responsibility to be accountable to u for his parents' actions... and his actions to MEDIATE between both. his parents' concerns are as valid as yours.

NOW, u have also put yourself ahead of your baby, much as u'd accuse him of that.

if both of u are in love, have a baby u Both want, are Already ready to build the family together... then Who is putting a stop to it now?

u might like to consider what u have to lose, and what he n his family have on the line... it isn't the marriage they are opposing... it is the LEGAL IMPLICATIONS of the marriage. it is not abt u, so dun take it personally... it is abt the preservtion of their family wealth which was built by themselves n their ancestors etc...
 

miloice

Well-Known Member
powder, while it could be reasonable to want to be accountable to his parents, I believe the hurt is more with the lies and excuses given to get her out. Naturally, it strains the relationship. The need and right to safe guard ones interests doesn't excuse for the lack of sensitivity towards their partners. Its a badly managed situation. Her hormone changes affecting her emotions isn't helping either.
 

susanna_low

New Member
Jamie, as both of u have only been together for less than 10months and being a foreigner, there's possibility that in case of divorce, u might just split the assets and bring the bb back with u.

His parents don't know you well and the insecurity is there.
That's the reasons of the drastic measures especially the negative image of foreigner.

The elderly might be just conservative and close minded.

Take the time to prove yourself to them. There will definitely be obstacles in every marriage.

The family is yours, it's your hb that u will spend the rest of your life with and not your in law.

Don't give up easily.

Take care and pls don't use the word "abortion" easily. Any negative feeling will affect the One. Please treasure the little one in you.

As a mum myself, I jus feel even if the whole world give up or misunderstand, my child will be there for me no matter what. She is my precious pillar of strength.
 

susanna_low

New Member
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jamie1712

New Member
Thanks everyone for the advice.
@chocolatte (cococherry): Thank you. Im 14 weeks now.
@60secs:in my most angry moment, I may have thought of those. But these two options may not make my life any happier than where I stand right now. It takes lots of anger and hatred to do that and no matter how hurt I was, have been and will be...the only thing that I may be able to do is to walk away.

@powder: really appreciate your comments though they are harsh for me to hear now, but the truth is still the truth, issnt it?
If it is just about protecting one's assets. I have already agreed to the pre-up, to whatever dollar and cents that they may draft out, to the clause of no alimony if divorce within 5 years..to everything they can even imagine. I am willing to sign it. So I really think I have tried to put my baby first when he puts his assets first.
But their money concern doesnt seem to alleviate even when there is a pre-up, they still things of other bases to cover ( like matrimonial house). Could you tell me based on your logical thinking that they will stop doubting, letting me licking my wound until it heals and go on having a happy baby when I meet these 2 demands of theirs? or they will continue poping more creative ways of securing their assets in the future?
If it is just for protecting their hard-earned money, I understand. I am not happy about it now but I understand and am getting used to the idea. It is really if you are in such a righteous position why you need to lie your way through it?
Could you tell me how these will affect my family in the future? When I know my hubby doesnt trust me at all to even tell me how much he earn. When my in laws are only concerned about money.
And the best part is that: he told me that he knows I am not after this money cos he wont never agree to a marriage if I am a gold-digger. This whole fiasco is just because he wants to be careful. I thought to myself: "at what cost?"

Powder, I do consider what I have to lose...I lose my love for him, that may possibly put the end to his marriage and he possibly lose his alimony and child maintenance for me. Even when two people start out with love, strong love, over time their flames die out, they drift apart and divorce...what about us? Starting with bad blood, revolving around money concern, what is left to go on then?

Once again..I am very grateful for your comment. I think it is what a rational, straight mind minus all feeling should think. It just that my heart bleeds and I cant control how bad I feel.
 

1127

New Member
From what I see, your hubby does not trust you enough in the first place. He is afraid you are after his money. Maybe that's why he wouldn't disclose his income to you, even after living with you for almost a year. But now he has made you pregnant, he should come to terms with his insecurity and be open to share a life with you together. But i don't think he is ready to do so.

On top of that, he is already in his late 30s, yet his family is pulling all his strings in his life with you. This maybe is because he already dont trust you much, or his apron strings are still very much attached so he listens to his family who are maybe convinced you are after his money, or both of the above.

If you marry him as he is now, this will carry on into your marriage life. I can see no difference in his behaviour when you tie the knot with him in two weeks time. Problems normally don't get easier after marriage. Usually they get worse.

Your situation is serious, now that you have a baby and your wedding is in two weeks time. He hasnt got you your wedding bands and all he is more interested to do before the big day is protecting himself, from what i can gather from your description. I am not in a position to counsel you, you can approach a lawyer or a professional counsellor for advice. All I can say is if I were you, I will

(1) state the terms that for a marriage to work, he must be open about his income and financial standings, amongst any other things you wish to know about him, and not hide from you. If he wouldn't, he does not trust you.
(2) if he does not trust you, don't marry him. Dont enter a marriage for the baby's sake. The baby wouldnt grow up happy if the parents are not happy. The wedding is off. So what! Let it be off.

(3) if you chose to abort the baby or not, it is up to you. If you don't want to kill your baby, let it be borned and you raise your child as a single mother, or put up for adoption.

(4) if you choose to leave him and decide to keep the baby, then fight for your rights. You should consult a proper lawyer. PM me. I am not a lawyer, but I have contacts for you. I probably wouldnt move house and insist for a pre-nup on my terms and go through the wedding. Then file for divorce after that. Don't forget, if you are keeping the baby, you need money, and he has to maintain you and child and everything. He has to bear responsibility.

Get a counsellor to advice you on your path you should take. Get a proper lawyer to advise you on your and your baby's rights.

Please PM me. Click on my username and I will give you contacts that are affordable. I am not a lawyer.
 

infojunkie

Active Member
"On and off, he will pressure me about how our child will get disadvantage ( if a gal) as her mother is not affiliated member of any primary school or when his friend whom i have never met, think of me as some kind of terrible, money sucker foreigner woman that Singaporean woman will lose out to"

he's too preoccupied with money and prestige, overly petty and very lacking in EQ...

a deadly combination that makes him highly undesirable as a lifelong partner.

why marry someone who constantly reminds u that u dun 'belong' in his league and can never measure up?

so it's opt 2 -- put baby up for adoption
 

jamie1712

New Member
Hi Jac,
I have PM you..I new here so really not used to how things work on the forum.
Thanks so much for the advice. I think it is very reasonable and address my concern: he doesnt trust me. How could I ever be able to build a family with a person that doesnt share a bed with me but doesnt trust me.
 

margret

Member
james, do u think u can depend on this kind of man if u are giving birth?

will he ask u to pay for your own delivery charges or even ask u to pay for the baby maintanence.

But from what u mentioned, u should have saw this coming when u were still not marry with him, why did u wan to stick yourself into it.
 

miloice

Well-Known Member
One of the reason for breaking up with my ex is her endless need to protect herself, justifying her right to. There is no need to protect yourself from someone you know without a doubt will stand by you regardless.

If he is doing it to assure his folks and protect their interests, fair enough. Come clean and work it out together. Not lie and cover with excuses. Such actions doesn't add up to trying to be together.
 

1127

New Member
Hello James,

14 weeks is second trimester. Abortion might not be a viable option for you.

Yes, I would suggest not to enter marriage unless issues like these are resolved.

Good luck!
 

1127

New Member
Hello James, correction. 14 weeks is second tri and abortion is still an option in Singapore, though 2nd tri abortions are more complicated, invasive and risks are higher.

For 16 weeks of 2nd tri and after, the procedures used are yet different and even more invasive. 3rd trimester abortions are not done in Singapore, unless for exceptionally good reasons.

There are emotional and hormonal side effects to watch out for, lasting weeks following 2nd tri abortions. Be prepared and discussed with a good gynae if you are looking at abortion as an option. The longer you wait, the higher the risks for you.
 

momoftwo

Member
Jamie, relax.. take a deep breath...

#1 He is insecure. that kind of insecurity is very common among people with money. Those without money will not understand this kind of insecurity.

#2 If you are really not a gold digger, then why are you so upset about how he and his family handles their assets ?

EARN the trust.. Just because you got yourself knocked up by a rich man.. does not equate to automatic trust endowment.

You may be the baby's mother.. but it does not means they must accept you into their family. Your baby is not a meal ticket into the high rollers society.

If you are from a well to do family.. then why are you paying for your brother's education ? Are you being honest to yourself ?

Live a humble life centered on your baby's well being. As long as you do that.. no one will have any reason to fault you or point their finger at you for being a self serving woman.

Also, give your man a chance to take care of you and your family.

Just ignore his family..Singaporean men had been screwed over by many foreign gold diggers in our not so glamorous past..you may just be collateral damage.. bad reputation from those before you is something you need to live through and rise above the stench and dirt.

and really, if you desperately wants a ring so badly, why don't you just go get one yourself ? It's really not very expensive you know.

Engagement rings are for couples planning to get married.... but you are pregnant out of wedlock.. that fairy tale no longer applies to you.

If you keep getting angry about your soon to be husband over every little things.. then you need to be careful about having the baby blues.
 

60secs

Member
Leave the guy. What kind of a man gets his parents involved. That's what you call a boy (or momma's boy) and a sore loser. So what if he earns 8 digit salary but being that stingy. 90% food court... 10% restaurant.. that's a joke.

I spent $20k on bags and diamonds on my gf when I was earning 5 digit figure. Before I marry her (and I started earning 7 digit figure), I bought condo at Red Hill for her (under her name as mortgager) and I am the sole borrower (50% deposit paid) and a BMW. I have no intention of boasting here but I do all that to express my trust and love for her. I married her without any pre-nup; and I have a portfolio of 21 properties (5 in Singapore). I eat 95% at restaurants and 5% home/food court and all out of my pocket since I was dating her. Marriage wouldn't work without trust and definitely will never work with a third party getting involved.

Obviously this idiot cares about his money more than he cares about you. Ditch the bastard. Pardon my language..
 

oneder

New Member
"(4) if you choose to leave him and decide to keep the baby, then fight for your rights. You should consult a proper lawyer. PM me. I am not a lawyer, but I have contacts for you. I probably wouldnt move house and insist for a pre-nup on my terms and go through the wedding. Then file for divorce after that. Don't forget, if you are keeping the baby, you need money, and he has to maintain you and child and everything. He has to bear responsibility."

This is the part where it scares most of the guys in Singapore.

As married man, we are most willing to share everything we got with our wife. Even things goes sour, we should take up responsiblities to provide the nesscesary support to the mother and child.

But to have a mentality like that, to PLOT to go through with the wedding in order to Fight? for what you think belongs to you.... is kinda drama... And this is precisely what the guy is preventing.

Your bf or his parents will probably do this to whoever his bride is because there are people who plotted to get half the husband's wealth from the start.

With that said, i think James should be better than this. Trust is to be built after your marriage in your case as the dating period is too short for anyone to truely know one another.

Not saying that it is fair for you that others doubted your character before knowing who you are but you got nothing to lose if you sign the pre-up or move out of the property because you aren't expecting to get any share out of his and his parent's wealth.
 

1127

New Member
Lee,

The SG family law favours men, and is unfavourable to women. The women here, unlike in States or other countries, do not have half of the man's assets upon divorce or whatsoever.

Here in SG, for a 30 year old marriage of a housewife who earns $0 a month all her life, illiterate, raise kids, do all the housework for the husband: if she file for divorce, and is contested, the court will grant her anywhere between 10-30% of matrimonial assets. Max is 30% and she has to fight very hard in court, chalking up lots of legal fees. Anything above 30% is hardly heard off. Perhaps in very rare circumstances. What more any women who are educated? Women are disadvantaged when SG family court law is concerned. I am referring to contested divorces. Uncontested divorces as long as both parties agree to the terms, the court does not care. I perceive James' case to be a case of contested divorce. The man might want the child.

Also my suggestion to her is based on the option she takes the choice of divorcing and raising the child herself.

You might be also identifying with the wrong man. This man is not the loving husband. Read James' post again and ask yourself: will you do what he is doing? Is that how you love your wife? If not, then the woman has to protect herself, seeing that he is protecting himself from her.
 

1127

New Member
Lee, 

I suggested stay in the house - don't shift: As a loving husband, will you aim to move your pregnant wife and yourself out of your own 3 room private apartment and do a rental to target moving date before wedding day? The man himself revealed his concerns why he is doing that. My suggestion is to stand your ground. Do not shift out, knowing his intention is such. If you are the woman and you realise your husband is doing this to you with such intentions, would you happily shift? Don't forget you are pregnant with potentially a child to raise on your own.

The pre-nup was firstly brought up by the man. Will you, a loving husband draw a pre-nup and said you rather have your child aborted if your wife-to-be wouldnt sign? The man did. Why so, if it is not to protect himself against her? She did not ask for a pre-nup. Her situation and her choices might require her to do a bit more 'drama' than usual. Then he didn't want the pre-nup later, why again? His love for her? Or could he have realised SG law does not recognise so there is no point? If I were to draw a pre-nup, its would be on my terms - does not imply I will disadvantage the man. I will want to make sure the terms are fair to me and our child. While pre-nup is not recognisable in court, it can lend weight in a divorce, for the benefit of the woman and child, in the case of an uncontested divorce.

I don't know what is her next course of action. There is also a possibility her wedding ceremony abroad, depending on where, may or may not be recognised in SG yet. If so, this woman could be in a very disadvantaged position if she choose to leave and raise the child on her own. If she wants to leave now, she is in danger of not getting anything at all. So, legalise it. Go through the customary here. I am no lawyer, so I am just suggesting this is a way to legalise it. The man is not walking down the wedding aisle in innocent bliss and love-struck eyes, he is busily thinking how to do this and that to protect his wealth against her and his unborn child before the big day. I wont worry for him. He seems fully capable of looking after his own wealth.

If she decide to divorce him and gain custody of the child, it is highly possible the woman cant claim any maintenance anyway and as for matrimonial assets, he is also very guarded: the man did not disclose his financial matters to her, upon their marriage day they were staying in a rented property (very smart of him), and he did not pay regular bills for her in the past. Not that she needs to live off him - she has a nice job. But if he wants to visit his son/daughter every weekend and bring him/her out to play and be called daddy-daddy, he has to bear due responsibility. If its the woman who is going to do all the "dirty work" (raise the child), who is going to be financially paying for all of it? To raise a child in singapore is not cheap. Medical, cost of living, education, varsity tuition fees etc.  It is tough to be a working mother, what more a single working mother.

Note that if she leaves him or not, now or after walking down the aisle, he is the biological and legal father of the child. So he has to bear responsibility. What the woman can do is to get him to share this responsibility in an equitable way. His hiding and planning behind her wiill put her in an unfavourable position to negotiate equitably with him.
 

jamie1712

New Member
Dear all...thanks again for the advices and comments. It helps me to see things from different angles.
@margret: i see it coming, its not ideal for me...but im pregnant and I dont really have much a choice. I know there are woman who are in worse position than me ..suffer from abusive husbands while they are the family bread-winners. I think Im still fortunate but still... i felt hurt.
@Milo: that is exactly what I have in mind right now. Its not that I oppose to the pre-up. I agree to one and yet that is not enough. What torments me the most is that when all these will end. If anyone here can tell me with reason and confidence that these will be all. I will bite the bullets and work towards a marriage
@momoftwo: thank you for your honesty. Based on your posts in this forum, I think that in most cases we see things very diffrently ( I can relate lots of people will have the same thinking as you, just they dont normally say it to a person face but aloud in their head). I,on the other hand, dont think it is a crime for being in a short-gun situation. It wont make anyone less a person, to not deserve this and that. Having an engagement ring is not part of the fairy tales ( if you are dreaming of 500k diamond ring then maybe..but I am not!) and I am marrying no prince but a middle range earning income man with lots of concern over the assets ( ironic issnt it?). But thanks again for sharing your view.
@Junkie: thanks
@60 seconds: thanks for the sharing ...It gives me faith in people and in Singaporean...I know there are lots of kind hearted man out there..just I am not a lucky gal. All the best to u and your wife <3
@clipperjunk: ^^ maybe!
@lee: thanks for the comment. We stay with each other for more than 12 months now. We are the kind of couples that do everything together, every single day so I guess we kinda truely know each other in some sense. It is hard to disguise oneself for that length of time and he is no stupid man.
Thanks for believing in me that I wont go through marriage just for a revenged divorce cos that is what I will never do. I view marriage as a life time commitment and I will never in it to hurt someone the way he hurts me. It just never a solution to anything..not me ..not my child.
Last but not least..
In my view, you dont need to move out of the house and a pre-up together to protect your assets.It is because a pre-up covers everything which I let him draft on his terms (he can state the house inside or whatever).
I have told Powder in my earlier posts what do I have to lose...which really freaks me out. I am scared that I no longer love this man after all the pain he inflicted and I want my marriage to work
@Jac: thanks so much for all the support. I really appreciate it.
 

jamie1712

New Member
Hi momoftwo..
Dont mean to pick a fight with you but I think your statements are abit contradicting with each other.
In the thread of "Can any one kindly guide me how to check someone marital status? " u wrote:
"Milo, ask yourself why got valentine day ? Why have to bring her to go special treat once a while ? Why must men need to constantly show appreciation ? Why ?
If women are secure, we wouldn't need to buy expensive gifts, we wouldn't want our men to do nice things for us.
All those special stuffs you do for your wife.. are VALIDATIONS of your love for her. Women NEED validations.. because we are simply INSECURE people. Some women are more obvious... these are the ones you guys coined as "clingy". Some women are less obvious.. these you call as "independent". But if you stop giving her validations, she will will start questioning your love for her. When she starts questioning, you guys coin it as " INSECURE". "

But in my topic that I am asking for help, you wrote:
"and really, if you desperately wants a ring so badly, why don't you just go get one yourself ? It's really not very expensive you know.
Engagement rings are for couples planning to get married.... but you are pregnant out of wedlock.. that fairy tale no longer applies to you.
If you keep getting angry about your soon to be husband over every little things.. then you need to be careful about having the baby blues."

I think it is purely mean to discriminate against out of wed-lock woman and if you really dislike such people you can just ignore their post, why is such a need to hurt people by hurdling mean words?
 

powder

Active Member
james,

"Could you tell me based on your logical thinking that they will stop doubting, letting me licking my wound until it heals and go on having a happy baby when I meet these 2 demands of theirs? or they will continue poping more creative ways of securing their assets in the future?"

- it's either they dun know u, or they tend to distrust before trusting. i dun think your guy's action is totally of his own accord, but under pressure to allay his parents' fears and insecurity.

"If it is just for protecting their hard-earned money, I understand. I am not happy about it now but I understand and am getting used to the idea. It is really if you are in such a righteous position why you need to lie your way through it?"

- i dun see it as a lie, to be honest. he probably has difficulty telling u, which of cos isn't a great thing either.

"Could you tell me how these will affect my family in the future? When I know my hubby doesnt trust me at all to even tell me how much he earn. When my in laws are only concerned about money.
And the best part is that: he told me that he knows I am not after this money cos he wont never agree to a marriage if I am a gold-digger. This whole fiasco is just because he wants to be careful. I thought to myself: "at what cost?" "

- the cost of the fiasco is the vein of emotions u currently face. the matter is complicated yet simple if u break it down.

thing is, both of u have dated for abit and proceeded to go the next level. i dun believe in apportioning blame, but to go into matters with the thought that all involved have their set of responsibilities.

your choice to feel emotional over this matter is not wrong, but isit that right either? therefore it's not a matter of who is more right, nor wrong... it is how each of u in the situation choose to react.

personally if i love and wanna be with a girl, i'd not be overly bothered with the wealth issues. i can sign whatever they want to protect their money if that wins their trust... since my ultimate aim is to be with the one i love... as for my baby, i guess the kid will eventually have his/her right to protect his/her future in event of my early demise. else i'd be self-sufficient.

things might change after gaining acceptance and entry... things might not, the family could continue to be distrustful... i dun really care so much cos money is something we can build on our own anyway... not all of us need millions.

i'll just get past the first obstacle and let the rest take its course. IF i'm not accepted by parents but accepted by wife - i'm fine. if i'm not accepted by parents and my gfren/wife has to tip-toe around both parents and me thru'out the marriage... then perhaps i would not even go into it.

how do u see the future? if u think it's gonna be harsh, then perhaps the future is something u might not wanna take-on.

if u figure u'd breakup if there isn't a baby, then the answer is obvious. i am more inclined to be anti-abortion, but there are many instances where i sometimes know in my heart that perhaps an abortion could have saved several lives at the expense of an unborn.

nobody said life was easy... ultimately what is... is.
 

miloice

Well-Known Member
jamie, anyone and everyone that reads pick up the contradiction except that idiot herself. That's pretty psychotic and delusional. She will just ignore the contradict and turn it to another attack on you. My advise, don't bother, u cannot talk sense to a person with psychotic condition. They are very far from reality.
 

momoftwo

Member
Jamie, I do not despise women with shot gun marriage. In fact, some of my best friends are shot gun mothers. I encouraged them to keep the baby and try to live a normal life, although their situation was far from a normal start.

Today, many of them are living a very happy normal life.. some went on and have more children with their shot gun husband.

Right now, you should be focusing on more important issues instead of getting angry about that engagement ring.

here's why you need to put that engagement part past you.

Engagement rings is a token of promise.

Propose for acceptance of marriage , engagement ring.

Get married, wedding band. You and your husband choose the wedding bands together.

Then get house, then get pregnant, then raise a baby together.

Do you see where you are in the whole process of starting a family ?

You are way past that, Promissory stage.

Now, I suggest you focus on that wedding band instead, it's something you will need for your up coming wedding.

Then focus on your family nest together with your husband.

Your husband is moving you into a 5,000 dollar a month apartment, if I am not wrong, that's a private service apartment ?

Would you rather go live in a HDB 4 room flat instead ?

You do know that most people on this forum are not even earning $5000 per month income yes ?

And your husband is willing to blow that $5000 per month to provide you and the baby a roof over his head.

Think about this.

Be more realistic and you will not be so angry all the time.
 

infojunkie

Active Member
if u hv doubt abt the guy u're going to marry, even the slightest, dun do it...

if achieving happiness is the ultimate goal.
 

momoftwo

Member
For those of you who thinks that other Western country is more "generous" to women.

You are wrong.

In USA, any assets acquired BEFORE the marriage is personal property. Not to be divided during a divorce.

Only assets acquired AFTER the marriage is community property. To be divided under the fair/ equity family laws.

So no, wives don't get half of his assets all the time.

Marriage needs to be more than 10 years before she is entitled to full alimony. Else it's half of the duration of marriage.

For a foreign bride, if she is not married for very long.. the only thing she gets to keep is her permanent residency..(after 2 years minimum) that can possibly lead to a citizenship.

As for prenup.. yes it's enforceable here in USA, but still subjected to the fair/equitable family law .... so is a POST nuptial agreement.. much like what Tiger Woods' ex wife wanted.

I don't want to go into details.. but just want to dispel some people misconstrued ideas about other western countries.
 

momoftwo

Member
Jamie, I understand that you need validation that your man cares for you more than his assets.

There are many forms and ways of him showing you he cares for you.

Yes indeed, blowing several thousands on a stone is one way of showing you how much he values you...but surely, you are worth more than that.

He is possibly not the most romantic man in the world.. but most men arn't anyway. Marriage will not change him into a Romeo anytime soon, if at all.

Given the short term relationship you had with him, there's a whole lot you don't really know about him yet...

What is important is you keep your expectations realistic and practical.

There will be many people here and out there.. who will try to induct certain ideas of what your man should be... I suggest you take it with a grain of salt... and only retain what is applicable to your life since you will be the person who is living with him.. not them.

Use your adaptability skills you've gleaned so far from your foreigner experience... you're a survivor.. not a quitter.
 

momoftwo

Member
Mr Milo,

Yah yah.. I am a psycho, mad woman ( cue psycho music)... (cue silence of the Lamb clip)... ( cue Mr Milo screaming in the background)... the end.

Now.. since you are absolutely so convinced I am but a psycho... why do you stalk me in every thread attacking me incessantly ?

What is the point of you attacking a person you believe is mentally sick ?

Who exactly is the REAL psycho here ?

Are you trying to seek petty revenge for your wounded pride ? By all means.. carry on...
 

momoftwo

Member
Jamie,

On his family animosity/distrust/hostility/unacceptance of you.. you should not take it too personally. He has a part to blame too.

I don't know which culture you come from. But you must understand that, his family is probably not giving him an easy time either.

In our culture, getting a woman pregnant before marriage is still very SHAMEFUL in the eyes of elders. Especially to his family if they are of a respectable social status.

If you think that marrying into a rich family is a cake walk.. you may want to rethink that misconception.

If your husband's financial strength comes from his parents.. you'd be surprised how much clout/control his parents have on him.

Should you not play your cards right, he may end up ex-communicated and disinherited from his family fortune... is that what you want ? Just to prove his love for you ?
 

jamie1712

New Member
Morning everyone,
@powder and milo and momoftwo: Thanks for the continuous advices.

I took an advice of a member in this forum and went counseling yesterday. I have to say that 1 and a half hour really helps. My bf said to me : he really sorry for all the hurt he put me through for the pre-nup ( thanks powder for the correction ^^) and he previously had no idea what i was going through.
Bingo! so simple yet not easy to realize that I need a form of acknowledgement of what I am going through, what I am feeling.
Powder, the counselor shared with us..It doesnt matter whether you care about the money or not. If you dont care about the money, you are the woman with pride. And when people doubt you, hurt is what you feel. It all gets escalated when your partner doesnt empathize with what you are going through yet let the whole saga repeats itself once more time. The line " if you dont want money, then why wont you xxx and xxx" only makes sense to people who have never been through the similar situation. Because it is easier said than done. Things get worse when your partner not only questions ur integrity but willing to sacrifice the baby if his demand is not met.
May I emphasize the difference between the 2 statements below:
1)I am so sorry that I had to put you through this but this is the one and only thing that I want from you in order to have a marriage to you
2)Why are you not signing...what is stopping you if you dont want money.

@Momoftwo,
Given my skill set and education, I earning comfortably more than what you perceive most people on this forum do (5K). A 5k rental apartment can be afforded on my own. He needs a certain social status and is motivated by safe-guarding his asset. I'm paying for the maid and contribute a certain amount of money to the joint account to cover household's expense. So I dont think anybody is blowing any money on anyone.

Besides, I dont see anything not nice or less desirable about HDB house. I would rather staying in a HBD with a man who dots on me than staying in a 5k condo with a man who is so calculative with his wife.

The reason that I consider abortion or adoption is that I am very much concern about how my situation will affect the child emotion not entirely because of my constrained financial resource.
 

jamie1712

New Member
Momoftwo,
1) My bf family is middle income family in singapore, by no standard ( even in my country) consider a rich family.
2) All his financial strength comes from himself
3) There is no fortune to inherit
4) His parents are ok with the short-gun...only concern about $$$
 

1127

New Member
Hello James, I am so happy to hear that he said that after just one counselling session :D .... If you think it will work out for both of you and you both want to work out the relationship, then I am very glad for you. Sincerely.

My earlier suggestions to you on this thread might sound a bit "off" but I had ruled out the possibility of him turning around before the customary wedding. I assumed wrongly, I suppose.

Personally I dont believe in taking marriage vows lightly, and neither did I do any pre-nup myself when I got married. I also don't go around telling my friends to do per-nups for their marriages. I believe in love. I don't believe in sucking the life-partner dry for one's own benefit. Hope you understand where I was coming from, when I gave you those 'unorthodox' advice earlier.

I am happy for you. I really am :D
 

infojunkie

Active Member
" took an advice of a member in this forum and went counseling yesterday. I have to say that 1 and a half hour really helps. My bf said to me : he really sorry for all the hurt he put me through for the pre-nup ( thanks powder for the correction ^^) and he previously had no idea what i was going through."

u sure he's not paying lip-service to get over it?

ppl do that all the time...
 

momoftwo

Member
Jamie, good to know you went through counseling and is able to work through the knots.

Your boyfriend doesn't seem like such a horrible monster after all. Perhaps he was just not a very tactful guy.

Prenuptial agreements are meant to protect not just the person who initiates it.. it is meant to protect both sides.

From protecting assets and from liabilities/debts that occurred prior to the union. It is very common to put a sunset clause few years after marriage and/or when a child is born.

Anyway.. take care of your health.. and the baby in your tummy.

Your child will be the only one capable of giving you Unconditional love.

Have fun being a parent.
 

momoftwo

Member
Jamie,

".. All his financial strength comes from himself
3) There is no fortune to inherit
4) His parents are ok with the short-gun...only concern about $$$..."

If he is able to stand on his own.. then I don't see any need for you to worry about what his family thinks of you.

They can think the worst.. so?.. what is important is what your bf/husband thinks of you.

Request that your bf/husband shield you from his family's hostility. Let him go deal with them.
 


miloice

Well-Known Member
if your husband is sensitive towards your emotions and caring for your interests, you wouldn't be having all these problems. There are clear issues with expectations. You cannot align them when the basic communication isn't working.

Couples will fight, they will be mad with each other. Anger is a natural emotion we will all face. What happens beyond the fight? Are issues swept under the carpet? Is it a vicious cycle? Ask yourself, is the relationship maturing and progressing positively or is every fight just accumulating more grudges than understanding. Don't expect that this to be an isolated incident. Is your expectation of the marriage realistic? After all the advises you get, you have to internalize and reflect on your relationship. What make sense, is the relationship in regression? The answers you can only find out within your relationship.
 

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