Switzerland

threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

Thanks. I'm thinking of buying the Swiss Saver Pass for the two of us. That's for 15 days and it costs USD286. My wife suggests taking public transport for perhaps the first part of the trip, and then rent car for the second part. If I buy an 8 day Swiss Saver Pass, it costs USD235, which is not a lot less than the 15 days one. So I might as well get the 15 days one for the entire trip. If she wants to experience going to out of the way places, then maybe we can try renting car for a few days.
 


rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

If you don't mind leaving early in the morning, and returning late at night, then there is no need to stay in Interlaken. You can easily check online for the time it takes for the train to go from Interlaken to the "top of the world". If I remember correctly, it takes about two hours one-way, but please double check.
 

threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

Thanks.

I have read of people in this forum who brought cup noodles to Switzerland (I wonder how they can fit into their luggage!). Is it ok to actually bring these food? Can we clear immigration at the airport with the food?
 

rtan

New Member
Hi Hellokitty,

Check out:

http://www.worldweather.org/

Hi Threasher,

I don't think bringing in cup noodles is a problem. I understand people bring it in for two main reasons:

(1) They are on a budget and want to save money because eating out is expensive.
(2) They do not like the local food.

Personally I would never bring cup noodles because:

(1) We love bread, potatoes, and French Food, and we can survive very well without asian food; in fact, we thrive on good western food.
(2) It is very sad to eat cup noodles on a holiday.
(3) You can always buy stuff form the supermarket if you are on a budget.
(4) Cup noodles are available (though not as wide range and more pricey) from the major supermarkets.
(5) We want to try as much local food as possible.
(6) You will be in the French part of Switzerland, and French food is fabulous, unlike German food.
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(7) Pattiseries (Pastry Shops) and Boulangeries (Bakeries) sell absolutely fantastic and mouth watering creations so it would be a sin to miss out on them! For breakfasts and lunches, you can feast on their creations.
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Threasher, I am curious about the time-share thing you bought; if you wished to stay in Paris, which hotel / resort do they put you in? Does the hotel / resort they have a website? I am curious to how good a location it is in. Thanks.
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threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

Just to check with you:

(1) Does those power adapter (3-pin plug) that we use here in Singapore, like those for mobile phone and digital camera charging, work in Switzerland?

(2) As you know, we will be staying in Torgon. If we go to "Top of Europe", I am not sure how to plan about it. I am sure going off in the morning and coming back to Torgon in the evening is not enough. So I am thinking of setting off from Torgon in the morning, and reaching Interlaken in late morning/early afternoon. At Interlaken we will check into a hotel, where we will stay overnight for that day. Now, for going to "Top of Europe", should we go in the afternoon of that same day, or morning of the next day? It seems that the last train down from "Top of Europe" is at 5pm. But if we go the next morning, we also need to check out from the hotel first. Your advice needed here! Including which hotel to stay in!

Thanks!
 

rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

(1) Please see:

http://kropla.com/electric2.htm

(2) It's a tough choice, because going to the "Top of Europe" (sorry it's not top of the world hehe) requires the whole day. If you go in the morning of the next day, you can always put your luggage in the left-luggage section of the train station, at a fee of course.

We stayed at:

http://www.hotel-blume.ch/e_index.html

It was not the nicest of hotels, and the bed was quite soft. But it is cheap if you go for the Jungfraujoch package.

Note that the train station to Jungfraujoch is some distance from the center of Interlaken and is not walkable with luggage.
 

threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

For Singapore, we are using type A rectangular plug. So we can't use in Switzerland? What is the solution?

It seems that there are many train stations in Interlaken (Interlaken OST, Interlaken West, etc). Is the Interlaken OST the one going up Jungfraujoch?

Do you know of any online map that shows Interlaken and the train stations around there?

The hotel rate seems to be CF140 per night, including breadfast, so I guess that is quite alright for us.

I think if we travel to Interlaken West from Torgon, we can check into that hotel. Then in the morning we check out, and then go to Interlaken OST station, and take train to Jungfraujoch, all along taking our luggage. Actually since we are only staying one night, we don't really have to carry much stuff. In the afternoon, we will come back to Interlaken OST, then take train back to Torgon. What do you think?

Thanks.
 

rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

For Switzerland, just get the appropriate adaptor for the Swiss style plugs. On the website, it shows you the sockets, as well as the two types of plugs that will fit into the sockets.

Yes, the train that goes to Jungfraujoch departs from Ost Station (East Station).

Your plan sounds ok, as long as both of you pack light. At 3800 meters above sea level, note that even climbing stairs can be very tiring (what more with heavy backpacks!) because the air is very thin. Not to mention it will be cold so you will be wearing thick clothing.
 

threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

For the plug, are we able to get the Swiss style one in Singapore?

For going up Junfraujoch, I am wondering whether there is any place that we can store our bags while we take the train from Interlaken OST. I know that there are some stations that have coin operated lockers which allow you to store things.
 

rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

Yes, you can get the plugs in SG.

The train station should have some left-luggage facility.
 

threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

Where in Singapore can I find those plugs? Do you know of any specific store that sell them?

By the way, I was recommended staying overnight at Wengen or Lauterbrunnen if I want to go up Jungfraujoch, because they have better scenery and also because they are nearer Jungfraujoch.
 

rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

The plugs are quite widely available, e.g. I got mine from one of those bargain stores at Clementi.

That's right, actually the view from Wengen is quite spectacular, but it is also more expensive I think.
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threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

My friend told me that the plug can be bought from a DIY shop in Singapore.

By the way, a friend of mine who had been to Switzerland told me that we don't really need to book hotel room in advance. At the train station, we can find out a list of the nearby hotels and their rates. Then we can go to the hotel we want, and if it is a family owned hotel, we can even bargain the price. Is that true?
 

rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

Sure that's possible, if you don't mind dragging your luggage everywhere you go. But since you are already fixing the date that you are going to Interlaken / Wengen, why take the risk that all the hotels are fully booked? Where are you going to stay then? What if there is some major festival in town?

Bargaining is something that is generally frowned upon in the West.
 

threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

I went to the website of that hotel in Interlaken. In the reservation page, I am supposed to choose the package. Do I have to choose a package?

Also, what is Halfboard?

Thanks.
 

rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

I don't know, I am not the hotel owner?

I think you can just Google for Halfboard and you will find the answer.
 

rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

Just to add on; when we booked our stay at Hotel Blume, we booked with the package first for one night, and without package for two nights; but it turned out that the owners did not record down our second booking. So we had to communicate and confirm with them through e-mail, which was no problem at all.

Halfboard is a common term for accommodation; hotels will offer you bed and breakfast, half board, or full board. Many hotels only have bed and breakfast; some offer accommodation only.

Hotel Blume serves Mexican food; we never did try it though it seems that they have favourable reviews. We just didn't want to go all the way to Switzerland to have Mexican food; we wanted authentic Swiss food, which is mostly German since Interlaken is in the German part of Switzerland.
 

threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

It would be better if you can tell me exactly which shop in Clementi you bought the adapter from. Is it in Clementi Centre? My trip is less than 2 weeks away, and this weekend is my wedding dinner. Got no time to search high and low for the adapter. So far a few shops I asked but to no avail. Thanks.
 

threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

Another question: there is a VAT on purchased goods in Switzerland. I read that we can ask at the shop for the Global Refund Cheque and reclaim the VAT (http://www.whartonzurich07.com/05-travel.html). The total purchases in a shop must amount to CHF 400.00 (including VAT).

Does that mean that if my purchase is more than CHF 400, I can ask for the Global Refund Cheque? Do I need to use this cheque somewhere to reclaim the VAT?

Thanks/
 

rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

The adaptor is widely available anywhere; I got it from one of the bargain stores at Clementi next to the old bus interchange. It's a combination of two plugs; one slim two-pin to two-socket one, and another two-pin to three-socket one. You can then plug your Singapore British appliances into the three-pin socket. I don't remember the exact address.

Besides going for "budget" solutions like I did, you can also buy those $10 or so multi-adaptor packs you can get from any hardware or travel store.

Sorry I never purchased anything expensive in Switzerland so I don't know.
 

silvia

New Member
Hi,

Need some help here.
Doing my research for Switzerland.
But... the more I read, the more I am being confused.

1) Can anyone please advice me, which train to take from Italy (Milan) to Switzerland (Zermatt)
2) Any recommended hotel in Zermatt?

** URGENT!!! As I am leaving for my honeymoon this thursday!

Thanks for your kind assistant.

Best Regards
 

threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

Tomorrow night I'll be flying off to Switzerland with my wife.
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Beside Torgon, I have booked a one night stay in Lauterbrunnen next week, for convenience in going to Jungfraujoch. The hotel seems quite nice even though it is 2 stars. The room has a balcony facing a water fall (the 12th largest in the world).

Thanks for all your time in answering my questions here!
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rtan

New Member
Hi threasher,

That's great. It's a wonderful view. Note that the water fall is quite some distance away so you won't see it so clearly from Lauterbrunnen.

Sorry if some of my replies have appeared to be a bit abrupt; but hope the little advice will be useful. Be adventurous and have lots of fun; and watch out for pickpockets.
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Bon voyage et bon chance.
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PS: Do let us know how the trip went once you return.
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elite88

New Member
I am planning for F&E from Italy to Switzerland (Rome - Venice - Zurich - Interlaken - Lucerne - Zurich.)

I am confused with the rail tickets that I need to buy. Is there a train ticket that I can used to travel both in Italy and Switzerland itself, and at the same time travel between Italy and Switzerland?
 

threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

I'm back
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We stayed in Lauterbrunnen for 2 nights. The room has a balcony that faces a water fall, the 12th highest in the world, according to the web site. Staying in Lauterbrunnen is definitely a better choice than Interlaken. It has a much better scenery. Interlaken looks boring. We went to Jungfrajoch from Lauterbrunnen. The temperature there was -1 degree celcius. It wasn't much windy, and it was ok for us. We don't find any breathing problem like you cautioned.

Will update again.
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threasher

New Member
Hi Wendy,

I suggest that you stay in Lauterbrunnen rather than Interlaken. And go to Geneva instead of Zurich. There are more things to see in Geneva.
 

threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

We stayed at the resort in Torgon for the entire duration. The resort was high up on a mountain, similar to Cameron Highland. But it has a better view of the valley. You can see the mountains, and some of them are snow-capped. The bad thing about it is that it is not so accessible. We took the public bus, which does not come often. It comes at 6.38am and 8.18am during weekdays, and during 6.45am and 10.15am during weekends. The last bus back to the resort leaves at 6.55pm and reaches the resort at 6.42pm. The road up the mountain was a narrow one, and there are no lights. So if we drive (which we didn't) during the night, I think it can be quite dangerous unless you are experienced. There was a day when we took the wrong train, and ended up having to take taxi back to the resort. It was the most expensive taxi ride I have ever taken. I think the distance was no more than 20km, but the trip cost us about CHF90! Luckily I only made the mistake once! My goodness, those taxi drivers must be earning easy money! That one trip is probably what Singapore drivers earn in one day! Because of the bus schedule, we have to stay over at Lauterbrunnen so that we have enough time there and Jungfrajoch. It is a bit silly, I know, to have the resort and yet booked another hotel. But overall, we still spent about $1100 total in accomodation.

We actually liked the resort in Torgon a lot. It is certainly better than staying in a hotel. It has a living room, a kitchen and a balcony. We were able to buy food stuff and store in the fridge. It has a microwave, hot plates and eating utensils. So basically we can buy food and store, and heat up. The sofa is so comfortable too. Even more cosy than our new leather set in Singapore. We were also able to wash and dry our clothes for a total of CHF8. We only did it once near the end of the first week.

We didn't make use of the facility in the resort like the swimming pool or sauna. The restaurant was not even open. It was the lowest season at that time. There were very few people. Most of the activities like hiking or biking was not available.

Having no knowledge about fondues, we asked the operations manager at the resort about it. He then brought us to a restaurant near the resort, and treated us to a meal of original, tomato and mushroom fondue. I think it was very nice of him.
 

rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

Sorry, I thought I might have mentioned that taxis are prohibitively expensive in Europe, but perhaps I forgot to say it.

So where did you get to visit besides Jungfraujoch?
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My guess is Zurich? Geneva? Luzern? Which place did you enjoy the most?

You must know already that Switzerland has among the world's highest cost of living also because they are among the world's richest countries and they have among the world's highest salaries. So, what seems very expensive to us is quite affordable to them.

You saved a lot on accommodation, which is very good. I just hope your extra traveling expenses (taxi ride, cost of train tickets to and fro Torgon) and inconveniences did not outweigh your savings.
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Where did you have dinner every night?

So on hindsight, would you do exactly the same thing again? What would you recommend to your fellow Singaporean travelers, now that you are more experienced? What tips do you have for us?
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I don't understand about hiking being unavailable; don't you just go out there and walk on your own?

Yes, the Swiss are among the most hospitable and friendly people in the world.
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Thanks for your sharing.
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threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

I don't think the Swiss have the highest salaries in the world. Our host, the operation manager, who is a Swiss, told us that living in Switzerland in not easy. Salaries start at around CHF1000 plus, I think CHF1800. If you are a waitress, you will be earning just CHF1000 plus. If at the end of the month, you can save US$500 for a couple, that is considered very good. But normally, most people can only save US$200. Our host told us that to live confortably, with a house and car, you need to have a salary of CHF5000 plus. Most of the people living there don't eat outside because it is too expensive. They eat at home. Even when they want to marry, they need to consider carefully on the financial impact first.

I think train and taxi are very expensive there. I have taken taxis in Paris and the U.S., and they are certainly not that expensive. I think a short train ride like 15 minutes from one city to another would cost more than CHF10. Therefore, a Swiss Pass is a logical choice when going to Switzerland. It also allows you free admissions to museums, which include Chateau De Chillon.

For food in restaurants, I think it is not that expensive. You need to remember that they are restaurants, not hawker centres. However, because we are tourists, we have no choice but to eat outside everyday. And that's why we feel that it is expensive. If you eat in restaurants in Singapore everyday, we will also feel expensive. To buy cheap food, you can go to COOP, a minimart similar to Cold Storage or NTUC here. A 500ml Coca-Cola only costs CHF1.25. A 1 litre milke only costs CHF1.40. If you buy the same coke from a vending machine, it is CHF3.50. In restaurants, it can range from CHF3.00 to CHF5.00. I wouldn't think that this is expensive, because in Singapore, if you order coke from a restaurant, it will also cost you a few times more than what you get from a shop. We buy a lot of bread a milk during our stay. Bread is also cheap in COOP, less than CHF2.
 

threasher

New Member
We have dinner a couple of times in a Chinese restaurants in Aigle, the nearest town to Torgon. We went there because (1) it was open from morning till night, (2) it is not expensive, and (3) the food is ok with my wife. My wife does not like the food there much. She thinks that the bread is too hard, and the food variety is not much like in Singapore. The restaurant has Chinese dishes like fried rice, chicken curry rice, which we can get between CHF8 to CHF14.

Paying more in other restaurants did not seem to be worth it. We once had lunch on a train. It costed more than CHF40 for both of us, but the food looks so simple. So never eat in a train restaurant! The drinks are reasonable though.
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I tried to find meals that costed about CHF12 per person while we were there. If no choice, then had to go for CHF20 per person. If not for my wife, I would have taken burgers at McDonalds or pizzas everyday.

The good thing is that we stayed in a resort with a kitchen, so we can even buy those instant fried rice from a minimart and heat it up in a microwave.

Overall, we spent about $6000 for both of us on this trip. If we had taken a package tour for the same number of days, it would have a lot more, I think.

If I can have it again, I wouldn't stay in a resort for the entire duration. Just for one week in that resort in Torgon would be enough. For the next week, we can move around, like say stay in Lauterbrunnen.

From Torgon, we visited places like Montreux, Geneva, Bern, Zurich, and Zermatt. For Zermatt, we had to take the 6.42am bus so that we can get there early around 10.30am. This is so that we can have enough time because we need to take the train back at 3.30pm. Actually we went back to Zermatt the next day to actually go up the mountain in the cable car, but it rained on that day, and it was very cold. So we didn't go up at all. I am not sure whether having gone to Jungfrajoch would be enough, such that going up the mountain in Zermatt is unnecessary since they could be the same.
 

threasher

New Member
When I said hiking is not available, I meant to say that it is usually done during summer, when it is one of the high season (along with winter). I am not sure where we would go for hiking, and I'm sure that my wife would not be keen. She would rather go somewhere else.
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rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

Sounds like both of you had lots of fun.
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Yes, you definitely saved money compared to going on a tour package. Hope both of you liked the flexibility and being able to see whatever you liked and to stay as long as you liked in a certain town.

Probably the restaurants you tried served German-style food, which in my opinion is not that great. Restaurants that serve French food are much better, but I think overall French food is probably cheaper (and maybe better?) in France.

The area around Zermatt is quite different from Jungfraujoch, plus you get to see the famous Matterhorn. Mountain weather is quite unpredictable and when it is cloudy and misty you can't see a thing. We were fortunate to have fantastic weather from our honeymoon last year:

http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/4964/img1757sw6.jpg
 

threasher

New Member
Most of our photos were of both of us taken together.
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We actually brought a tripod along so that we don't need other people's helps. My wife was the one who adjust the camera and setting and set the timer. I just stand there so that she can get the shots correct. It was interesting to see her moving the tripod, camera and trying to get the shots correct. I think some caucasians seemed amused by us.

If I share photos with you, then you will be able to identify me.
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Anyway, I don't have the images with me right now. It's in my wife's notebook at home. I haven't develop the photos yet.
 

bubble_low

New Member
Hi threasher,

Juz wonder did u go to Swiss only ? Which airline did u take ?

If go by 2 ctrys, how did u book the air flight ?
Thks.
 

rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

No problem. You mean all the photos you all took have at least one of you inside?
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You mentioned that the food you ate was mostly terrible. How did you choose the places to eat? Was it randomly, or through recommendations from a guide book?
 

threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

Most of the photos have at least one of us inside. There is only a few which do not have us.
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I think the only photo which you would be interested to see, without any of us inside, is the one which we took from the way up to our resort. It shows the view of the valley, with all the houses, etc.

The food is not terrible. But you just feel that it is not worth the price, especially for those that cost us more. The restaurants that we ate in a found randomly, not through any guide book. The most satisfying meal that we had was a restaurant in Zermatt, just opposite the church. It sells Kenny Roger style roasted chicken. For a one whole chicken, cut into two halves, with a piece of bread each, it only costed us CHF14 in total.
 

threasher

New Member
Hi Low,

We took Turkish airline. I guess you would need a travel agent to help you with the flight arrangement if you are flying to one airport in one country, and going back from another one in another country. This may be more expensive, but I could be wrong.
 

rtan

New Member
Dear Threasher,

It is true that it is not easy to find good restaurants in Switzerland, though guide books will certainly minimize the chance of a bad restaurant. There are lots of tourist traps.

But in Geneva or Montreux, it should be possible to find good French restaurants that are not too expensive. But then again I haven't been there so I could be wrong.

French food is just amazing...
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threasher

New Member
Hi Raymond,

I don't really know what food is exactly French. To me, they are all western food.

I think the area around Montreux is beautiful. There are so many colourful flowers. We bought back some flower seeds as my wife wants to try growing them in our balcony. I am not sure whether the flowers will grow in Singapore here, and whether it is legal in the first place to bring back seeds from another country and grow plants here.
 

rtan

New Member
Hi Threasher,

Sorry, I thought you did have some guide books that would recommend you certain restaurants while in Switzerland?

I think you should try some German food and French food in Singapore if you have the chance. They are very different. Although they may use similar ingredients, the way they cook it is quite different.

It's like saying Chinese food and Malay food is the same. Though they sometimes use similar ingredients, they're not the same because the style of cooking is quite different.
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I'm not sure about legal issues, but my suspicion (I am no plant biologist) is that most of the plants will not grow. Do you see the exact same colourful flowers in Singapore? Do you see the same Singapore flowers over there? My guess is, no to both questions.

Even if they did grow, how long would the flowers last? How long do tulips last in Singapore? The heat causes them to wilt very quickly. Also, tulips are imported from Holland; if we could have grown them here, we surely would.
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Just my ignorant views.
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