Sharing finances?

[miloice]

vios, it couldn't get lamer to relate starving a kid to death over cigarettes with children's right to exploit their parents' wealth. Pretty consistent with his other tits squeezing milking justifications. And oh.... in his avatar world, everyone is being personal but him. Time to wake up from the dream.

 

[scope_guy]

Hi Vios,

Everyone's wealth creation is different. Everyone's fortune is different. Unless he or she harms the society, say... murder, rob or rape, there is nothing much really to be bothered with. For such situation as within a family and so on, I don't inclined to pass judgement.

清官难断家务事儿. Which is, even the best and most just officer can't decide household matters... including this. So who should hence judge, especially on characters or mindsets based on this?

So get the drift? It's a sin I will avoid since it is so avoidable by simply don't judge. Many people condemned Mr Lee Hsien Loong for his rise merely due to his Dad. If this PM can work, who cares?

We can say whatever we want. Outsiders are always outsiders. Many Chinese rich 2nd generations were also planning expenses based on their parents' money, to be frank. They open shops, and expect their parents to cover for their failures just in case.

But if they make it, you'd see the world reporting on their 'secrets of success' being what hardwork, being smart, being this and that... Bullshits. It's just money, family money.

So, we can only be good for ourselves, and for that sort of matter, don't be our own Gods.

There is nothing about individual's character or mindset. At the end of the day, there will be those evil and sick bastards who don't plan on parents' money but go and cheat and rob and bully and harm the society for it, and I have met kind rich kids in China who have the ambitions and they also plan on their parents' money for great things in life.

Money is money. It all depends on how you use it. See?

What Powder and Milo, and probably Thomas, are stuck in is that they see a very narrow view of things... as if they are so perfect themselves to assess God's creations. As I have said, in China some expect Men to give expensive house to parents and even wives... Can I hence said that Milo or Powder have character or mindset problem if they don't?

An angel is an angel, a demon is a demon. And money wise, money is money. That's to me so.

 

[sgbabydoll]

If it's money, everyone in the family has a share of it. OK, how about family debts or debts incurred by an individual family member?! Would you without hesitation and condition settle it for them??

 

[miloice]

once again, all views are narrow except his avatar one. LOL.

Free entertainment from 'THE RESEARCHER'.

 

[powder]

Scope,

those are purely your views, i dun see why u need to pass it off as having some worldly well-travelled influence to it... other than trying to give some form of credibility to your twisted claims.

then u use isolated examples of exceptions like our MM/PM... but u fail to realise that our PM has gotten the mandate on his own merit. by your declaration, u are implying something very dangerous and holds little truth. we have a very very capable PM. Again, i would like to invite u to substantiate by telling me who u KNOW is more capable.

problem with u is u give your own views and try to make it seem like it is a very informed view. u keep masking it with unsubstantiated claims that is so obviously a figment of your own imagination. just becos nobody called your bluff, u go on thinking u can get away with more and more such claims...

u've totally lost the plot here. vios has made a pretty good summary on the crux of the argument... and as usual, u talk irrelevant stuff and hide behind your 2nd generation chinese story.

i have no doubt pple spend their parents' money... but planning with it when they're alive n kicking? u're trying to make that something that is right and totally justified... how high can u stand on moral/ethical grounds if that is wat u promote?

u have misunderstood me, and u know it. but it's too late to back down now...

 

[thommy]

Wise men speak because they have something to say,

Fools speak because they have to say something.

 

[scope_guy]

Doll,

Do you know how many families whose elderly chaps passed away and hospital bills and funeral fees are left to the younger members?

Some bills come by the hundreds... but, (eg) there was one case where an old folk was hospitalised with operation and that bill alone for once was about over $300,000.

So, what do you think?

Simple. Don't judge. The parents' ultimate hope for bringing a child to this world is of course by right to help him or her grow and survive.

And nor that family yours, nor that children your business, and especially nor that money, or even a premiership... Who are you to judge? See?

 

[miloice]

by this logic, there shouldn't even be the need for any legal system to mandate children to care for their parents and for parents to take custody and care for their children. Who is the judge to judge. LOL. SEE?
Avatar thinking.

"The parents' ultimate hope for bringing a child to this world is of course by right to help him or her grow and survive." Not sure we can say that to the HK parents that starved their kid to death over cigarettes. But well, its their family, no one can judge. So says the avatar. This is the so called well traveled view.

 

[powder]

again, acting like u know things...

"Do you know how many families whose elderly chaps passed away and hospital bills and funeral fees are left to the younger members?"
- no, do u? dun act like u have the statistics and the information leh... not when u're presenting arguments this way. u definitely dun know, and dun have the info. the reversed implications u're trying to create here fools aunties... like those pple selling vaccuum cleaners who create fear by talking bacteria n germs.

"Some bills come by the hundreds... but, (eg) there was one case where an old folk was hospitalised with operation and that bill alone for once was about over $300,000."
- Uncle Chengo? what's your point in this example?

"So, what do you think?"
- NO, what do YOU think?

"Simple. Don't judge. The parents' ultimate hope for bringing a child to this world is of course by right to help him or her grow and survive. "
- erm, when u're a parent, u will know there's more to these 2 points which u think is the point. one day, YOU will understand...

 

[kittenpie]

why doesn't a moderator step in and end this thread once and for all. the thread is straying.

let's all just stop talking about this and talk about something else more fun and interesting lah!

 

[miloice]

May, you can propose that to CL.

 

[kittenpie]

Milo, who is CL?

 

[powder]

May,

all threads will stray... just as u dun meet frens to talk on 1 topic n insist they stick to that topic only. why should it end?

seriously speaking... if u dun enjoy a conversation... u dun have to be part of it. moderating is more on spamming, flaming, trolling etc... or when the language gets very bad.

there isn't any of that here. there's certainly a difference of opinions, but there's also impt lessons to be learnt here. we dun walk away from arguments simply becos it gets unpleasant... but we stick to the points and rebutt them and develop the ability to refute and dismiss claims that are non-factual or points that are irrelevant.

this actually develops pple's abilities more than simply walking away... and if u are one of those who wish to walk away, i dun think there's a need to ask the police to come over to monitor a healthy discussion.

 

[miloice]

Chin Leng. the moderator and owner of this site.

 

[kittenpie]

powder,

i get what you mean. there is always such a thing called forum etiquette. and a healthy discussion like you are describing is everything a forum should be about.

but the thing is, sometimes we waste our breath talking to people who just want to argue for the sake of argueing. this in turn provide those people a bandwidth to broadcast their ignorance. how about just ignoring them?

 

[vios]

scope,

of course we are outsiders and can play no part in the family matters... but it's not like i'm trying to play judge or God by disagreeing with this form of wealth creation. as it is clearly for me, it's bumming and just being lazy.

although the whole concept with planning solely on parents' money doesn't sit well with me, i can't deny that these individuals surely have different ideas.

so even if a family itself is rich - i'm looking from the self-reliance perspective, rather than plainly waiting for hand-outs or bail-outs. the rich parents, of course, can try to help along the way but def not to the extreme extent coming from the 2nd gen chinese family that you have very much quoted.

hence for me, it's still about one's character (developments) and mindset if we're merely talking about the fundings for a business start-up, as this "source" of capital....

is entirely different from convincing other fund investors on a certain project that one has to be really adepted with.

 

[powder]

need to dismiss some falacies first, before i can go into ignore mode. else the fella will continue to lie... once u can dismiss a person totally, then the job is done.

 

[sgbabydoll]

I don't buy his "We are outsiders, what do we know about people's family situation" crap. In other threads he's rattling on about people's relationship and marriage like he wasn't an outsider.

 

[scope_guy]

Doll,

It's up to you to buy or don't buy anything. You can choose to be clowns, or you can choose to wise up to prove your worth.

Whatever have been required, I have already answered. And it's not only to or for you. Those who will make sense, will make sense. Those who won't... won't.

Just try applying your nosense and see... LOL~

 

[sgbabydoll]

What do you know, you are not me.

Thanks for your theory, damn useful.

 

[scope_guy]

Doll,

At least you find the value in my theory instead of applying your own nosense. LOL~

I'm glad you find something useful.

 

[vios]

well scope

talking abt proving one's worth, then how worthy is the child to get indulged with the parents' money for personal plans?

a little bit of help might be expected by kind parents but the full-blown type doesn't necessarily apply wisdom along with it...

and it doesn't make sense with the whole entitlement thingy just because the child feels so because he/she is their child.

 

[powder]

the joker already painted himself into a corner, now trying to shamelessly get out... so u won't be expecting much sensibility out of him.

 

[sgbabydoll]

Scope, it's my application of your theory, but it is still MY application. I have ownership of the application. It is from me. What do you know of it???

 

[scope_guy]

Hi Vios,

And is that your family, you, your children, your money? Do you know exactly why, the workings behind the lives of the family, family traditions, what really has been happening within that family?

The parents produce the child, they have their up-bringing issues, they created the environment, the provide also the obstacles or aids... Parents and their children... a family entitling to their own issues.

We do not need to bother about them, nor to judge them.

The only thing that doesn't really make sense is that we tried to be busybody when we don't expect other people to be busybody with our family matters. You see what I mean?

A disgruntled sibling may go around telling bad things about the next sibling who may be getting more, without telling others how he or she has been benefitting in kinds or so from the parents. It's the same...

We are outsiders, I don't judge a persons' mindset or attitude on this. If he or she got the money, I only know how he or she utilises the money. If it is good use or bad use.

What are parents for? What are children for?

Some parents expect to raise their children so that their children in turn feed them, but they don't care about their children's fortune, nor do they provide more for their expectations... Such as they expect their children to be like the next child, going to banks, become big managers and CEOs and they expect their children to this and that but they also expect to keep their children right next to them, bombard their children with chores even during exams and such...

And you say it's so fair that we can just blame or judge?

Many rich kids in China... Many blame those kids. But their parents are mostly busy with hookers, majongs and making money... ... To those kids, whatever they do, they take from home...

For those who waste money, yes... we say something. For those who try to make it in life, we should encourage them and not condemn them because (say) Mr Lee HL is MM Lee's son, so we condemn such child for planning their future based on their Dad's political capital.

Try to make sense, because by trying to be one's God is already senseless. Look at Doll... She tried to accuse people of not being sensible, and she... LOL~

I don't know what to say about these people but to just ignore them... since they have nothing productive.

Yes. My views. But if you people expect me to say what you want to listen so as to make sense...

Go get a parrot.

 

[scope_guy]

Doll,

You are applying my theory, and how much do you know about my theory. LOL~

You guys and gals are really silly... If you continue like this, I'd have to ignore you again.

You just want to argue non-stop on petty nosense and pretend to be smart, there is nothing productive from you other than... cutting in people's communication with some silly libels...

And you tell me honestly... Are you not stupid?

Fine. If you want me to ignore you, just go on talk nosense... for all I care. What don't make sense, won't.

 

[sgbabydoll]

Don't question me whether I know your theory or not or how much I know about your theory. You are not God. Don't play God.

Based on Scope's sloppy theory.

 

[powder]

scope,

why do u keep trying to divert pple to something other than the initial argument u made when u barked up the wrong tree, bit off more than u could chew... and simply engaged wrongly?

u have been wrong from offset and nomatter how u try to hide it, it's not working, it simply isn't. is it so difficult to admit that u called it wrongly and just move on?

 

[powder]

alamak, the "ignore u" thing is like little kid saying "dun fren u"... and i already mentioned that yday...

 

[sgbabydoll]

Exactly, Powder! If want to ignore people just go ahead why need to announce. Do I care (oops, don't I sound bloody familiar)!

 

[powder]

already left a back door open earlier liao yday liao, but he still went at it... and keep trying to imply how well-travelled he is and becos of that his views are superior but keep going around middle east and china only... i dun know man, would have given more benefit if he had actually answered some obvious need-to-be-answered questions to cupport his claims... but he keeps creating new things to divert pple away from questioning him...

quite a sad figure...

 

[thommy]

aiyah powder/doll/milo, scope dun fren us anymore liao lah...see?

LOL~

 

[sgbabydoll]

Another totally narcisstic character.

Thomas, Scope don't friend you I friend you lor. Maybe later Scope springs out to stop us from befriending each other without his blessing hahaha

 

[thommy]

wahahhaa...machiam like kindergarten kids.

 

[sgbabydoll]

Maybe he is attending a middle-eastern kindergarten.

 

[vios]

scope,

like what you've based on - definitely the settings differ with families and how they handle things internally. something that we outsiders cannot judge too much... this one, probably yes.

look at another aspect to any family setting - one's 100% entitlement to parents' money and such - it's typically lazy and self-centred mindset that i've been talking about... could be in s'pore or china or with some middle-eastern tribes, doesn't matter.

yeah maybe like you, i shouldn't be bothered with the source as long as they know what they're planning with the "entitlement"... but frankly for me, it isn't something admirable with this head-start like some would be...

sourcing for the next car, next condo, etc. of course, some would be ambitious with some business plans and fall back on "further entitlements".

if for me (and some others), i would only be bold to declare a Self-achieved success when there are positive returns, including "the initial business loan from the parents". that's what i would take on instead of.....

shamelessly referring it as "an entitlement to parents' money". no LOL for this at all.

 

[hweebs]

woah, the thread so happening these days! I thought the earlier part was talking about entitlement to parent's money as a (negative) moral value and mindset...how come the discussion of value became the discussion of individual families?

 

[powder]

cos someone made a boo-boo and instead of retreating, reasoned so far up his a$$ that he finds it hard to back down without throwing smoke bombs to mask the mistake.

 

[simpleman]

powder, it probably took you a while to realize that he should be ignored.. probably you did not read his earlier posts.

For me and milo, we discovered it awhile ago.

No.. I am not ignoring him.. sometimes he make out some sense and it is ok. else if he is not talking sense.. really no point to engage him because he goes round and round.

About inheritance. I think it is one of our weakness (I mean the Chinese/Asians). It is no suprprising that in our society, children will want to expect to inherit their parent's wealth. It is almost a given in their thinking.. which I think is flawed.

The Americans, for all the boos boos that they have done.. are far more advanced than us in this aspect. Just look at what Bill Gates and Warren Buffet are doing with their wealth. They gave most of their wealth they made back to to society, to the world rather than to their children.

 

[simpleman]

"Do you know how many families whose elderly chaps passed away and hospital bills and funeral fees are left to the younger members?"

And the scope guy brought up the above point. Obviously he knows nothing. The major restructured hospitals used to be my customer. I can tell you, there are many old people who had passed away - yes big bills.. they children either cannot afford or mostly they ran away. The govt picked up the tabs mostly for these.

I had a case of a man died about staying 3 years in hospital. The children were not around. The govt has to waive off the bill. Some children stayed around and if they can't afford, they will be asked to pay about 5% or 10% or through installment if they can't afford the 5% or 10%

 

[powder]

ya i wasn't here for the earlier posts... but didn't take too long to realise. actually it's kinda fun knowing he'll do a hamster-running-on-wheels... u just bring up 1 credible point n u see him running round in circles to diver the attention n come up with something new and irrelevant, which is meant to deceive.

i think the insurance money upon death is more than sufficient.... even if 50k or 250k... it's free money n more than covers the funeral... the medicals are another issue but we're less likely to burden our kids with bills than our parents who were less exposed to the benefits of insurance. giving enormous amounts of money to our children may indirectly oppose the values for which we're bringing them up on.

as for the medical bills, yeah can agree... cos we had a massive bill reduced when dad died.

for all the un-sporean-ness this joker tries to display... i think he combines some of the worst characteristics of sporeans...

 

[scope_guy]

SM,

For some reasons... Did I say that the children paid what??? Just say that I used to work for the government... ... LOL~

I was waiting to fish Doll... but I fished you. LOL~

Vios,

There is nothing shameless in such entitlement. If you seriously compare to the cultures... since Singapore is like a multi-cultured or a migrant state, you should be open-minded about such things that you obviously ain't in the position to judge.

Yes, I understand what you are saying.

Admirable or not, it still depends on how the money is used. I do not think it is so more or less admirable if someone were to waste his own money or someone were to plan anything on his parents' monies.

Achiever, like any business, is about luck. See? But the issue is still very simple, we are outsider, we don't know about what really is happening within that family or what about the children.

So for me, I don't judge. He's a good man, he'd be a good man with the money. In my world, I only see good man or idiots or evil... Simple.

Hweebs,

Don't be lazy, it's all up there. Read up.

 

[hweebs]

oh, now i'm lazy, besides being disillusioned and the many other labels that u put on me?

wake up, scope.

 

[scope_guy]

Hweebs,

You are lazy, so go on sleeping. LOL~

I know you people's problems. I was reading Milo's reply to Denise80 about me. Doll was obviously hostile... I was chatting with Miyako San, and she jumped in telling her nosense about me and such... what relevance was that? These people are obviously troublemakers.

And Doll even tried to jump in using my what theory... when she did so in such a silly manner. Like Milo, he once declared: I gave different advices for different scenarios and I was what... inconsistent or self-contradictory...

You people... simple things made so ridiculous. Isn't it obvious that different issues require different ops?

I am reading Milo's reply to Denise and the rest of those big talks... and Sm's jumping in the fray... Does Sm know where I was before? He doesn't. Does he know what I am trying to tease Doll with? You think I expect Doll to even 'submit herself in agreement to any sense I made for her'?

I was waiting for her to rebut, and trap her.

This will not do them good because this forum, their communication is binding them and reinforcing their own recognition towards their own rubbish. Powder told me he travelled and was exposed to cultures... the joke is, he is still like another narrow-minded Singaporean who doesn't learn anything, and he even challenged me on what cultures or places I encountered...

As if I should reveal anything to him, after all his travelling... he never grows up.

Hweebs, you can continue to go searching for commitment with love secondary as well.

But I have my views, and I put them up here. I am not going to be a parrot just to make those jokers happy. They can't even sustaintiate properly their stances... And I was still seeing people telling me in the 'Sharing Finance' talk using moral or guts-feel... where I don't even see a proper reasoning to sustaintiate such claims.

Doll said I am a wolf under sheep's skin.

Sadtz did come here with 3 kids dangling crying to those 'sheeps' who had been so 'sensible'... What sense did all of them make in return?

I have been watching all these nosense and taking note of the crap nicks here where you need to ignore you ignore. Those mockeries they have enjoyed among themselves on me only reflect their childishness.

I look out for reasonableness. If a case cannot be based on solid logical thinking, you can't expect me to buy or even bother. These people are childish and illogical. Look at what Doll did... Don't be lazy.

They are treating me like this is only because of their own complexes and ignorance. Which is if you are lazy to read, and you are telling me to wake up...

It's like a sleepy head telling people to make sense. Not good huh~

My issue with them is still... How can people be so defensive on junks in such ridiculous manner going to the extreme lows?

Remember Thomas? He's so childish, going around engaging people about how I look, and Milo going around telling people to ignore me when he literally followed me everywhere to respond on my talks.

They are obviously wrecked personalities.

Downright ridiculous. I come to this forum, and I even see local women promoting themselves to me aggressively by behaving like trash!

LOL~

Isn't this entertaining?

And you... you are telling me to wake up. Hweebs, if you are too lazy, just go on sleeping.

These people, if their mentality and attitude don't get straightened up, they are just bad influence... not suitable to be friends. Besides, they are just avatars to me.

I think it is very important for them to look hard into the mirror and see how ugly they are.

I am treating them like this is obviously because they have not proven their worth. Some of them claimed they are men... but they are like gu-niangs in their conducts and thinking... Petty, unreasonable, impossible, ridiculous, stupid and they say I label them...

How am I going to label Doll for her conduct, for instance? How am I going to label you, Hweebs?

It's all depending on how you behave. So, wake up. LOL~

If you are as smart as Denise, I'd tell you you are smart right away. I am so blunt that I won't even bother about doing a wicked curve. So I hit very hard.

Many in this forum need to wake up. I am not the type who goes around sayang-ing people for nothing. If you want respect from me, earn it.

 

[miloice]

well hweebs, its back to long messages. Truly entertaining isn't it. Wonder why he couldn't apply his avatar theory suddenly? What's the diff? Its pretty clear. Everything said here are as blunt. Too blunt for him to accept as the truth. So, he once again chosen to live behind his avatar world he created.

Cheers!

 

[powder]

Sope, dun Lie so blatantly...

"Powder told me he travelled and was exposed to cultures... the joke is, he is still like another narrow-minded Singaporean who doesn't learn anything, and he even challenged me on what cultures or places I encountered..."

- dun Lie! and i didn't challenge u, i merely asked u to substantiate your claims, something u are unable to do.

my exact words were "the travelling portion u share works on girls and the less-travelled, but dun assume everyone is ill-exposed. i was walking down the streets of la salina, and joining in mardi gras in bourbon street at 17... i dun even think that qualifies me to talk venezuela and their culture, nor americans. it's just about taking in Life in new perspectives."

it's abt taking in Life, not using your travels to bluff others into thinking u're some wise well-travelled guy. u can't even grasp what i was saying and have to resort to para-phrasing it and purposely changing the whole flavour to suit your argument... how lousy can u be?

if u ever go bankrupt, the highest chance is becos u lied, misrepresented and have a libel suit against u. u are a person who has no qualms spreading malicious rumours and telling lies... u dun face the consequences of having integrity issues in real life.

 

[miloice]

well... for someone that claimed to be all ready to offend the entire local sg women, he isn't even prepared to handle Doll's msg. LOL.

Its damn easy to talk big. Time to walk the talk.

 

[moistfaucet]

scope guy,

just take it easy with people here, don't try to talk up or talk win others. actually there is no point. just have fun.

why are you so stuck up about talk right with them? i just wonders. if they don't agree with you , ya just ok lar.

BUT,

I am glad the man like you here. have very unique personal opinion and you show that the world is not always evolve around myself.

lol.

but i will give my entire asset to my kids, but before that, my kids must show me that they are capable of DOING WHAT IS BEST for themself. NOT WHAT I WANT THEM TO BE.

I am not BILL GATES. so i do not FOLLOW his EXAMPLE. just as i said, even there is a few good trees, it does not mean that i have to LIKE THE ENTIRE FOREST.

 

[scope_guy]

Hi Moist,

In case you didn't discover yet, I simply put down the views... and when counterpart won't make sense and become personal... It wasn't me who tried to talk win.

I was the one who usually fvck care. LOL~

I can't take easy with nosense. It's just me. Especially when other people think the craps make sense and are logical. LOL~ It's one thing you throw a one line view, it's another thing to insist your own line view is logical and people offering another view would be deemed illogical...

Small matter. I just ignore the usual lot.

 

[powder]

how do u sleep with all the lies u concoct? u need to see a mental doc... this much lying might point to a mental illness..