Divorce Matters

sci10270

New Member
When we first got married, everything was fine. The arrival of the baby, the purchase of the flat, the getting-along of family members. All smooth sailing.

She has not been working ever since she got pregnant. Thankful for being able to be there thru out the growing stages of our son.

However things took a sudden turn when she started to hang out with some "friends".

We have been frequently arguing over her late night clubbing sessions. I even plead with her to go once per week, and come back early. Only to see her going on Wednesday, return at 7am +.

Whenever I question her, she goes harping on the topic of mutual trust. Right. I should trust her.
Fast-forward 2-3 months later.
Last Friday, as usual, she was out late, back around 5am. We quarrelled again.
Last Saturday afternoon, she vanished into thin air, without any trace or notes, leaving us (me & family members) worrying about her.
Last Sunday night, she informed me that she's staying at a guy's place and she's really very very sorry and ask if there's anything she can do to reduce the pain.
Yesterday night, she returned home around 3am to pack some belongings to bring to the guy's place. I woke up when I saw her and tried to talk to her. But to no avail. Son was sleeping soundly so I didnt wanna make a scene.

After thinking things thru, it seems inevitable that she wants a divorce. She told me that I could have the custody of the child & the flat. She just want freedom, to get out of this marriage.

My main focus is the child. Poor kid would have to grow up in a single parent family, subjected to the ridicules of other insensitive kids. But there's apparently nothing I could do.

Can I delay the signing of the papers? She's hoping to get the divorce papers done as soon as possible.
We bought a HDB resale flat and the MOP of 5 years have not been fulfilled. Plus I'm not yet 35 so I doubt I could obtain sole ownership of a HDB flat. Is it possible to appeal to HDB to grant on a case-to-case basis?
Plus my son is only 2 years old now. The wife has no capability to take care of the child but I understand that the court tend to give custody to the wife.

Last but not least, I'm trying to see if it's possible to file the papers personally instead of going thru a lawyer if we could amicably settle the custody & property matters.

Any advise & help would be much appreciated.
I'm too devastated at the moment and sincerely hope that fellow members could help me out here.
Thanks.
 


hotsnow

New Member
Despair,

I m not sure how to delay signings but if she is willing to give you the whole custody of ur son, you can use it to get sole ownership of the flat.
There is a family nucleus clause in HDB ruling.
Ur age is not an issue but $$ is.
Assuming the HDB flat is own by both of you then, you will have to buy her share if you want to keep this flat. ( hope her share is small)
btw, she sgreed to let you have the flat right?

Appealing wise, have to ask HDB.

Its true judge tends to give to mother but if she willingly give up custody of ur son, things is going to be easier.
DO you have a stable income? who can take care of ur child?
A stable good income will help very much in gaining the custody of ur child.
 

infojunkie

Active Member
this may sound crude, but i actually think it's a blessing in disguise. if all that she wants is a quickie divorce and nothing else, i will give it to her - something that work to my advantage.

u dun wan MORE trouble...
 

sci10270

New Member
Thank you for the prompt reply. Really helps.

Her share is minimal. At most 10k initial from her CPF OA.

Yes, she agreed to give me the flat + custody of the child. I'm currently working in this job for more than 5 years and income is stable.

Child will be mainly taken care of by my Mother who is retired and also a maid will be there to assist.

How does the family nucleus clause work? The HDB unit which I bought is 2 units apart from my parent's place. Meaning same flat, same level.
 

sci10270

New Member
@junkie: The point is, the son will be the one who suffers the most eventually.

I might be hurt & depressed currently but I'll be strong for the sake of my son. I really dunno if I should plead with her and hope that she return.
 

infojunkie

Active Member
honestly, her presence might bring more damages to u and ur son if she's not gonna change, OR change from bad to worse.

dun make the same mistake twice...
 

sci10270

New Member
It's highly unlikely that she will change anytime soon. The fact that she left home and didnt pickup any of our calls only point to 1 thing.

She's utterly irresponsible, isn't it? At the same time, she cannot bring herself to face her own parents.

Her mom told me last night that I would be her son-in-law & my son would be her grandson no matter what happens in the future.

I broke down in tears when she mentioned that. Her mom has been 1 of my greatest support and I really hate to see her heartbroken as well.

Dilemma...
 

hotsnow

New Member
It would be great if you buy her HDB share.
Which means pay her 10k plus hdb interest.
The law proceedings will guide you along. You dun have to pay her now.
If I not wrong is either pay her in front of HDB officer or lawyer or CPF (CPF most unlikely)

Family nucleus means you must have a family to own/buy a flat.
i.e. owner must have children of his own.
The area of your flat is not important.
But I feel relief your you cos your son will be with you and is in good hands of your mom.
I believed a better parent should get the child, not neccessary mother.
I hope you will continue to nuture your son, "invest" in his education and lots of unconditonal love. Plus guiding him in future how to love in right way, spot wrong woman before signing the dotted line and say pledge.
 

infojunkie

Active Member
"sorry but what do you mean by that?"

someday u will see... this parental instinct to save ur kid in trouble... ok i'm a cynic.
 

sci10270

New Member
The HDB share must be paid via Cash? Or could I transfer back the amount to her CPF OA account from mine?

Yes I do have a son but I thought single parent is not allowed to own a flat? Really need your advice.

Definitely, I'll focus on my son n his needs. Breaking the news to him would be the tough part. Any advise?
He does cry for his mommy once in a while but I always try to pacify him saying his mommy is out with friends and will be back later.

Law proceedings will necessarily mean involving a lawyer & fees or is it possible to avoid the fees? To be honest, I have my parents & son to feed.
 

hotsnow

New Member
Most importantly, she must sign on lawyer's with what she agreed - give up her son's custody + flat.
Dun just lip service.

I agreed with junkie - her presence may do more damage to you and your son.
What would your son think when he grows up only to see his mother always "mia" for other man?
How would he feel when his mother is never really there for him?
This will affect his mindset about women - Women cannot be his soulmate, cannot be trusted.
I m not scaring nor cursing you but he may turn to men for love (become gay) or abusive towards women when he grows up.
Its a vicious cycle.
Like we always teach kids that horror movies are purely animated, acted out, kids need to learnt/guide about proper love too.

You can do this for him.
happy.gif

Despair, would you stay in this marriage with the fact that she will NOT go through thick and thin with you?
"mia" to other man's arm?
 

hotsnow

New Member
Despair,

As long as you fufil the family nucleus rule. Check out HDB website and you will what I mean.

Payment wise, It should be cash. but hope gather more experts here and give you their views.
happy.gif

If you want cheap, can go "government lawyer" at ura there.
well, you can ask ur wife to apply cos there is a mean test of <$2000 salary.
law proceedings may be slower but cheap. really cheap.
 

hotsnow

New Member
I m terribly sorry but I think at his age there is no way of breaking news.
He is too young to understand adult's love.
He will be very imaginative,overflow of thoughts.

You tell him mummy dun want him le now, he may develop inferior complex. And it definitely affects his studies and social skills when he go nursery, kindergarten and etc.
My suggestion - just hid it till a few years later or more depending for you.
Later on quote an example to explain how man and woman just dun stay together.

Most importantly, DUN let him feel he is so bad and lousy that he get dumped by his own mother.
Let him know that you always be there, lots of unconditional love.
 

sci10270

New Member
Right he's not the reason for the failure of the marriage.
He's the victim, the person who suffers ultimately due to the fault of his parents.

I'll be there for him. Thank you once again.
 

hotsnow

New Member
lol!

'Her mom told me last night that I would be her son-in-law &amp; my son would be her grandson no matter what happens in the future."

I think what junkie means is a touching talk may allow them have some leeway against you charging her daughter.
Or having to have her grandson at her convenience without any commitment, more like a toy to me...
It just what I think. Thats why he tells you to wise up.
is it Junkie?
 

hotsnow

New Member
Despair,
Have you been seeing their true personality of her family members all the while from knowing ur wife, to marriage, till now?

What sort of person they are, you should have a rough guide in mind.
I m not badmouthing them but there are ppl who are like that.
Its her daughter afterall, how not to stand by her side?
Just beware.
 

sci10270

New Member
I know what junkie &amp; u meant about the fact that her mom might be harbouring some evil intentions.

But I personally feel that her mom's definitely not that kind. Ever since we got married, they have been providing me all the support I need.

Even at this moment, she broke down in tears when talking to me and she sound genuinely apologetic about the failed marriage, saying she failed to bring up her daughter properly.

I dun wish to hear any badmouthing of my inlaws as I truely respect them for what they did for me. even at this point of time.

Fair enough she's still her daughter. And she's still my wife. my son's biological mother. That's the sad truth of life.
 

infojunkie

Active Member
well almost, hotsnow...
dun think it's difficult for the mom to see that her daughter is at a disadvantage... but that's not evil lah, it's just human nature...

TS, no point playing the blame game really...
focus on taking gd care of ur son and he will become the well-adjusted kid u wish him to be...
take care and dun lose hope
 

sci10270

New Member
I never wanted to blame anybody. I want to end this marriage as she wished.

I'm here to clarify a few questions which I really thank you all for helping to answer.

1. HDB Flat
You, the applicant and your children under your legal custody(for widowed/ divorced) are eligible applicants for ownership of a HDB flat under the family nucleus clause

2. Child Custody
If wife gives up custody, I'll be able to gain full custody and provide him with all the care he needs.

3. Filing of divorce
I need more advise on this. With regards to legal aid assistance, should I be the one filing divorce when I'm not the one who initiated it?
Either way, she should be able to get assistance as she's not working. I should be able to, as well, cos my disposable income is low.
 

hotsnow

New Member
If you eligible to apply then go ahead.With a lawyer representing you, it be better I think.
I thought since she is not working, she can apply and you pay....
 

sci10270

New Member
Sigh should I be the one filing? My own parents are blaming me for the failed marriage.

I have no qualms about paying on her behalf but if I do file the papers myself, My parents will feel that I'm the one who wanted the divorce...
 

closezap

New Member
If you don't file the papers and she did, would your parents think otherwise? Like what junkie said about her parents, it would apply to yours as well. In the end, parents would tend to protect their own child.
 

shirleypoise

New Member
It shouldn't matter what others think since the marriage has failed for a fact. So long as you know that you have done your part u dun have to be bothered.

Usually the one who files is the one who is more anxious to get out of the marriage. If you guys want to divorce on her committing adultery (the faster route) then you will have to file against her but you will have to pay for PI as you need to provide court evidence. If money is a factor, just go for 3-year separation. Only thing you have to bear in mind is alimony cuz she was not working, making her dependent on you.

Btw, you should be able to use your CPF to pay for the 10k since the money will have to go into her OA account no matter what.
 

snoopies

New Member
It will be better if you do the filing yourself instead of her. Get evidence of her committing adultery otherwise you might have to bear additional cost of paying her monthly / lum sum alimony since she is not working. With the evidence, the court may not grant her for any alimony from you. Hope you had not deleted those sms she given you coz those can be proof of her adultery. With those, hiring PI will not be neccessary.

If I am not wrong, if you need to pay her a fixed monthly alimony, she can demand for higher amount as time goes when she is jobless or sick or when your income increase. And you have to pay her till the day she marry again but not you. If she is those who wanna play punk, she can just cohabit with any guy without any paper signing years down the route as she might see it as an additional income. This I had learnt from my friend's lawyer. Life is just so unfair rite..

To protect yourself, your property and your son... better to get all the evidences as backup and everything black &amp; white.

Hope this help.
 

tomasulu

Member
if your parents think that way, there is nothing you can do or don't do that will change their minds. obstinacy, that's what makes old people old people.
 

chris_lee

New Member
That's one. It's also a sad fact that many parents will do what they can to protect their own kids, even though they are wrong. Means, not many people have the guts to own up to their own faults lah.

Catering to how others feel will only add to your burden. After all, if anyone wants to tekan you, anything can be a reason, regardless of validity. Humans can be that ruthless.
 

shirleypoise

New Member
I'm not sure if you can do away with alimony even if she committed adultery... You may want to check on that with the lawyer.

If alimony is required, go for lump sum payment. It would be more difficult for her to claim for more.
 

swooshman

New Member
Dear Despair
I fully understand your predicament as i am also going thru almost the same scenario. My wife too has been out late for almost 3 years until i called it quits 1 year ago and asked for a divorce. Though i am not sure if she is having any affairs or not, I know she is out clubbing most of the nites when she comes home late.
My problem is she wants the children's care and control and to avoid a bitter court battle, i have decided to give her in exchange for almost 50% of the childrens access time. sigh! I hope i am doing the right thing.
 

sci10270

New Member
swoosh, could you kindly PM me your contact number? Would like to chat with you.

I tried to PM you but I think your profile is set to not receiving Private Messages. Thanks.
 

denise80

Active Member
This is saddening...because I also happen to know a female teacher (yes, now you all should know that a person's career has nothing to do with her moral values in life) who clubs all night long and is sick of her hubby who seems to be much older than her. She's heading for a divorce sigh...

Though I'm also a woman, I wonder what is this world coming to...with all these clubbings and stuff. I've already grown sick of clubbing since 25.
 

swooshman

New Member
I can understand her need to go out and have a drink and some fun with friends. However this should never be a priority over family. How can one be a responsible mother if one goes out clubbing on weekdays and come home later almost every day. My wife averages around 10pm almost every nite. some nites way past midnite. I know she is a workaholic and some nites could be due to work but then this should also not be at the expense of spending time with the children. Helping them with their school work, making sure that they have their proper meals, anything by just being around the kids.
The sad irony is most ppl would associate the father as the one who usually comes home late and not spending time with the children. Maybe it would have been easier if i was the one who is neglecting the children but then reality is I love to be at home around the kids. Tomorrow is 1st day of the new school term and I have just helped my daughter to pack her school bag, making sure she has all the right books and pencils are sharpened, etc. My wife cannot even be bothered as she knows I will take care of it. I know she loves the kids but she just cannot be bothered with their daily care as she will just get the maid to do everything or she knows either me or my parents will settle it.
I have seen so many mothers who will fuss over their children's school work, daily meals, health, etc. My wife never even asks what my kids have for their meals. She do as she pleases, whatever and whenever she feels like doing. sigh!
 

mewmoon

Member
@swooshman: Maybe you can get her to read a book titled "Beat The Bitch" by Tess Stimson. =x

It might just be a wake-up call for her.
 

ryklucwen

New Member
Despair, i just saw your post, and its now more that 2 years from the 1st post.

I hope all is well for you &amp; your son now!
happy.gif
 

guyguy

New Member
I'm in the same situation. My wife committed adultery and she still want to fight for children custody? Wonder how is she going to teach her children if she has the children custody. Any one in the same situation, pls help.
 

clipperjunk

New Member
this is of no help to you but just to highlight a case some years ago...an adulterous wife was granted custody of the children as the judge remarked she may have been a lousy wife but not a bad mother...
 

oneder

New Member
"this is of no help to you but just to highlight a case some years ago...an adulterous wife was granted custody of the children as the judge remarked she may have been a lousy wife but not a bad mother..."

Probably this is what Guy 38 needs to think it through too. It is not about who is a better wife or husband now. It is about who is the better parent for the kids. Have you been a better father to your kids?
 

messenger

New Member
How can an adulterous wife be a good mother? Wonder what kind of moral values is she going to teach her children.

How can a moral loose mother set good example to her children to follow when she commit adultry?
 

nichie

Member
Even a murderer or prostitute can be a great mother. Its about the selfless love and care for the kids and not about her deed or actions...nobody is perfect..everything happen for a reason..a woman may commit an adultery but are you sure the fault is on her? For all we know, may be part of the reason she is doing it for her kids, to give them a better future..a mother will do anything for her kids including sacrificing her own happiness. we only hear one side of the story..don't be so fast to judge...
 

tomasulu

Member
i see your point but lets not get carried away. typically, a murderer will lose his custody rights and i think that's sensible.
 

miloice

Well-Known Member
Stereo-typing exists in all walks of life. The court doesn't decide and make one a good or bad parent. Lots of bad parents with custody of their children as well. Even when one lost the custody of their child, it doesn't mean they cannot be parents of their child anymore.
 

susanna_low

New Member
Off track..it's not easy to be a parent nowadays especially as a SAHM now...I have been blowing my top since this morning and using the cane doesn't work...any good tips/webbie to be a good mum?
 

simpleman

Active Member
Off the track..

But if it is difficult to be a SAHM.. how about a mother with a full-time job.. Easier?

I think it is easier to be a father.. much easier than a mother.. and I am not sarcastic.. part of the reason is that a mother "thinks too much / worry too much", get upsets over little things.. and always think she is right and wants to meddle with every aspect of their children's lives.
 

simpleman

Active Member
Murderer loses custody for the simplest reason that you can't possibly take care of your children while you are in prison...

Court will mostly award the custody to the parent who in the opinion of the courts is the best care-giver..

Adultery is not a crime in SG. Normally it has no bearing on the decision for the award of custody.
 

messenger

New Member
Not all mother are selfless. Some mothers are self-centred. They are willingly to destroy the happiness of inocent children and bring disgrace and shame to both families by committing adultery. Why some married women despite in a unhappy married life do not commit adultry while some happily do. It all boils down to the upbringing and values. To some adultry is a selffish and morally loose act but to some, it is not. It is about personal needs, excitment and personal happiness without considering the feeling of the family and the innocent children of both family.
 


miloice

Well-Known Member
There are a lot of stereotyping mindset equating divorce and affairs as destroying happiness of innocent children and unjustified glorifying of stubborn people that suffer in vicious cycle convinced that its somehow noble and good for their children without realizing that they are simply narrow minded and making judgement based on their own values alone. Are children really happier seeing their parents suffering for all the years in unhappy marriages? Everytime, making them the guilty ones for their sufferings and kids should feel indebted to their parents for being stubborn in their own beliefs. Be really honest with ourselves. The next time u convince yourself u r being a noble selfless parent, think in your children shoes. They are not stupid, u can sense your unhappiness and lifeless marriage.
 

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