Powder, what's your story huh ?
Why are you here encouraging women to divorce their husbands ?
Are you a divorce lawyer ? Here to look for the next kill ?
Or another divorced moron trying to convince himself and the world he made the right choice and didn't fug his life up.
Soaring and returning to the cage indeed. LOL.. that's the stupidest shit I've read so far.. and that GULLIBLE Danielle is lapping it all up.
Really, WHO is stopping her from flying ? Cage? It's her HOME you idiot. Her husband never did restrain her.. she has the world with his blessing.
She wants to fug around, go ahead ! No one is stopping her either. When her husband finds out, he'll divorce her anyway.
She thinks divorce will grant her freedom ? What freedom, she was never in a prison to begin with.
Danielle is just another gullible depressed woman waiting to be taken advantage of. That's all there is to it.
u should just address the issue. instead of skirting by attacking my persona.
u dun always get away with things this way...
i have an ego, and it is well-placed.
u get caught bullshitting, u get aggressive on me...
your posts are filled with things that are Conjured in your mind and not even factual... i have no idea til now, why u keep having visions of D being sexually promiscuous and screwing around... when did that even happen?
your description of her leaves alot to be desired.
yes, i'm a divorce lawyer... u got me there, i'm caught, guilty as charged, i admit. i'm here to solicit business. u're sharp. freakin delusional.
This should be my last post to you about the 'promiscuous' in depression thingy.
If you read Uni of pittsburg's link, the one you quoted, http://www.medschool.pitt.edu/somsa/Depression.html, you will notice the first para talks about how depression affects others in their daily lives. It contradicts your earlier stand that there are people who are fully functional yet depressed. This is quite impossible to me, the nagging anf gnawing feeling of heaviness i felt was hard be ignored, unless the persons are in denial and wouldn't seek treatment.
Second para on symptoms of depressions talk about 9 symptoms for diagnose of depression. You need to have 5 or more for a prolonged period of 2 weeks for medical practitioners to be able to prescibe medication. For instance, if you just missed a promotion and feel depressed for a few days, it will not be classified as clinical, because after the few days you might feel better and goes on in life, so it is too transcient to warrant med. Otherwise everyone will be going to doctors for med. I mentioned my symptoms are of sadness, isolation and entrapment. Technically i only fit into 1 out of 9 symptoms (sadness) and so i shouldnt be even called depressed. But frankly, I couldn't care less about the label on me, do I? I did not self-treat nor self-diagnose, as you had claimed. I came back from the doc and google a bit more to know what i am suffering from.
What makes you think a psychiatrist will even give me any med if i have less than 5 symptoms? Probably he might even asked me to go home or go take an overseas trip for a break or something. But that was not the reason why I didn't see a psychiatrist but chose the GP instead. The GP charges me $108 for consult and med. A psychiatrist in private practice probably charges me $150 for consult alone. Since i have access to a GP who is qualified to treat psychological ailments, with whom I got to know and he also treated my said in-law till he/she recovered, I trust him. He is already trained by IMH. Hence, he is a qualified practitioner, one which you said I should consult.
The next para in the link talks about 4 types of depression. My symptoms fit in the first one: uni-polar depression ie: feeling down. The second one is bipolar depression, that means people alternating between sadness and hysteria, or mania, as the term suggest. Have you seen anyone who has bipolar? I have. My good friend's daughter has bipolar. She is in her teens, goes into days or weeks of depressed sulky mood, then snap out of it without reason, and goes into days or weeks of highs/mania. This is not to be confused with teenage mood swings. Mania is dangerous. The person suffering from mania exhibit prolonged and extreme highs, has ideas of invincibility or are dellusional, thinks she/he is super smart, everything is possible including thoughts she can fly if she jumps out of the window and so forth. This daughter of my good friend also declared confidently, during one episode of mania that she need not attend school anymore because she is brilliant and her school is not good enough for her, thereafter started throwing away all her books. She was neither that brilliant (she was at the bottom 25th percentile of her cohort in terms of her grades) nor was her school not good - she's in CHIJ St Nichloas - currently among top 3 schools in Singappore.
People with mania might exhibit the symptoms you mentioned such as being promiscuous. Yes you are right, but that is for bipolar depression. You do not understand what you are talking about and you are quoting out of context. Mine is unipolar, from every professional's point of view: my counsellor, my doctor. Even my medicine testify to that.
Momoftwo, please go and do more research yourself, you do not have enough knowledge or exposure in this area to make scathing remarks, not that I am going to care from now onwards.
I see the need to reply or correct you to put the records straight lest people here really think i am so depressed they shouldnt talk to me anymore and you have just cut off the network i needed so much.
Also this might be a good opportunity to share my experience with fellow forumers about depressions, bipolar and etc. Singapore is still a fairly conservative society. There are people who are depressed or have bipolar but shy away from treatment. To me, if all positive thinking does not work, just go to a good GP and get some med before it escalates to something less easy to treat.
About my counsellor saying my hubby has those issues? That was said years ago during the first time we had marital counselling and when I wanted to walk out. It wasnt something she fed me to milk money out of me while i am depressed. My depression is very recent. Get your facts straight first and don't jump to conclusion. In any case, he wanted to go to another counsellor and his own counsellor also confronted him about issues he avoided. Guess what, he also stopped going.
Reason for separation? I was advised then at those marital counselling sessions that i can file under unreasonable behaviour: Neglect. I couldn't sign it then. I caved in.
I wish you good luck on your marriage, momoftwo. Bye.
Leave it. No point arguing with someone who is ........never mind. Why sink to the same level?
Go get some lunch, my friend.
I have skipped all posts by Scope Guy, as suggested by another forumer who PM-ed me, and I am going to do likewise to momoftwo. Stop responding and she will not be able to have a platform to do any more damage.
Thanks for coming in. You have some good questions for me:
"about your husband's deliberate avoidance in sharing, apart from his personality alone, what else do you read from it?"
- Just to mention this: my definition of personality is that of a person's persona, such as a celebrity personality, a sports star etc. To me personality is the outside, eg: a charming charisma, a sense of humour, outgoing personality or pensive, bubbly or quiet. Character pertains to something more of the inside, eg kindness towards animals, loyalty to friends, faithfulness to your marital vows, ability to empathise etc
- to return to your question, I see his avoidance in sharing as something very deeply entrenched. It's stems from perhaps fear of being hurt. I am projecting now because that is one reason if you ask me why don't I share something personal to someone I don't know well enough. My first reason would be I don't want people to LOL or ridicule me, man! Fear. A very strong and powerful emotion to me.
"His discomfort is obvious but the reasons behind might not be simply because he is emotionally absent or unable to connect. A connection takes 2 to tango. The accumulated fear of your reactions with his answers could have influenced that behavior. The incompatibility and contrasting expectations comes to mind."
- yes, over the years I have exhibited as many responses as you can imagine. From taking it personally, to feelling hurt, to seeing how difficult it is for him, to empathise or sympathise with his problem, to leaving him alone to sort it out, to using women's methods to draw him out, to use men's methods as well, to just letting it go, live and let live, to playing 'hard to get' somewhat like Antxie's vid link eg: saying when you are ready to talk about it let me know and walking away and not mentioning anything for days and still NO RESPONSE HE HAS FORGOTTEN ABOUT THE WHOLE THING LOL....
- yes, my expectations and reactions have unfortunately played a part and has become also part of his reason he remains clam up
- and yes, we are very contrasting now. The contrast was not so great when we first knew each other. I feel that over the years i frequently looked back to learn from my past mistakes as well as try to learn from the mistakes of my parents in their marriage, but to me, he is much less reflective and prefer to just bask in the here and now. So problems he faced tends to recur somewhat. So the gap widens.
miLo On e RoCks, to add another point to "His discomfort is obvious but the reasons behind might not be simply because he is emotionally absent or unable to connect. A connection takes 2 to tango. The accumulated fear of your reactions with his answers could have influenced that behavior. The incompatibility and contrasting expectations comes to mind."
- He does have the problem to connect emotionally with people. One earlier post I mentioned about going for drinks sessions with my male friend and bringing him along? One of the convo is interesting. My male friend was setting up his own financial planning company and he was telling us the mission statement and convo goes like this:
- Male friend: The principles and core beliefs of conducting my business is 'care for others, then others will care you.'
- Me: Haha, not bad, but I beg to differ.
Followed by some convo about "care" and stuff, including me saying its all bullcrap about caring, all you want is to get people to buy your insurances lol, okay okay ... I am digressing here. Anw:
- Me: (addressing hubby) What do you think?
- Male Friend: (addressing my hubby) Yeah, let's hear what you think?
- Hubby: Erm ... Okay. The mission statement is okay.
- Me: (addressing hubby): Well, I was telling him caring for others does not necessary begets caring from others, what do you think?
- Hubby: Yeah
- Male friend: So what do you think?
- Hubby: Okay, it's sounds fine.
(Male friend and I gave up. Continue talking. Hubby look at tv screen on soccer)
- on another drinking occasion, this male friend actually asked my hubby something like 'i notice that you tell me a lot of what is the local economy like, which is useful and relevant, but you don't say anything about what you think about it,' I had to smile when i heard that, but it was a sad smile.
"you mentioned about your dad's decision to avoid all contacts with you because of your disagreement over defense of someone. Has it occur to you that its more than just a decision to speak up. How it was done has a significant influence on the outcome as well. When you spoke of inability to control how the abusers react and that you only control yourself, it isn't really true. We do have some influence to people around us and its largely how we choose to react and approach the situation."
- i don't see how I can answer this question without revealing too much about my own family. For the time being, I wouldn't be answering it. Unless, you can tell me how is it relevant to my situation here.
"You have done a lot of self searching to seek happiness, so do you know what you need to be happy? If yes, what support would you require if you are already so sure about your needs and plan. If no, why hasn't it."
- Honestly, wrt my marriage, I don't know how to be happy. I tell you what I want. I want to stay in my marriage provided there is real one to begin with. This is my first choice. It is not that my husband has only one fault. He has many others, like most men and women do, myself included, but to me they are insignificant. Nobody is perfect. I didn't bring up his other faults here because they are not eating me up. But his inability to connect with me emotionally at all is very difficult for me to live with. Staying here for so long has hurt me. So I have no choice but to leave. It's not so much as this is what I want. It's a "i can't do this anymore. What choice do i have?" thingy.
- I think my way forward is clear. Logic tells me to go. But my heart bleeds when I think of it. I am sentimental, you can say so. Perhaps too sentimental for my own good. I didn't want it this way, but what other way is there for me? I know what I want to be happy outside my marriage. Just that where my husband is concerned, my heart gets into the way, and i get very lost.Â
- Outside my marriage, i am objective and logical most of the time. In fact, i am, according to those who knows me, rather logical until they hear i want to leave my marriage, then they say i am crazy.Â Yes, i have my shortcomings and my temperaments, eg: i cant stand stray cats being kicked, i will step forward and warned the stranger to stop, and if he continue, i will take out my mobile and threaten to call the police. Injustice generally hurts me and i don't sit down and be apathetic about it. Such is my temperament. You can say I can be harsh or you can say I have a hard side to me. Yeah, I do. I am independent and can fend for myself, generally. I am holding a responsible position in my office. I am not a scared little kitten. I have some privileges such as extended lunch times and here I am talking to you on this forum this afternoon because this afternoon i am relatively free in the office I need not be back so early.
- My emotional faculty is fairly well developed too. I generally can get along with people and am well liked. Much as I don't want to admit, my emotions rule over my logic when marriage is concerned. So if my logic cannot dictate my actions, I am doomed. This has happened more than once when I wanted to walk out. I kept failing.
- Knowing what one needs to do does not necessarily mean he/she has the strength to do it, miLo On e RoCks. Hence, I come in here looking for support of some kind.
i think Scope got into your head. u've just been arguing outta your ass with no basis and applying charged emotions in the last few posts, without logic nor common sense.
u're steps behind even though u think u're ahead... u look but dun see, hear but dun listen... and u're throwing
this was never a start of things where she's seeking opinions and advice and she's stuck, it's a trodden path and benefit of doubt has to be given to her, that within her life & circle - that there were strong minds that have been there before she even brought it to the forum... the road has been walked and a trodden path is already visible...
sometimes even our childrens' decisions should be respected for it is Theirs.
the start was ok, but later when u kept going on and on about her making a mistake, her depression, her 'promiscuity???'... and u were basically grasping on to straws to present your case... the arguments were shabbily put together... my alarm bells rang thereafter, else i would never have addressed u.
Life is bigger than u, than us, than a marriage. why try to salvage a marriage if it impedes Life? why suggest there isn't a life without marriage?
Powder, lol and well-said. You are very enlightened indeed. But I have a bone to pick, pal. Her beginning was not exactly alright if you hear the tone there. I mean the sniggering that my dad didnt wean me off and stuff like that. I tried to respond as objectively as i could but at one point i failed. Which point? When she asked me how i stood up for my family member, i said like what you are doing now la. Lol. I knew that will shut her up but actually i didnt do it her way la. How to? Aiyo. Then there was also this remark she made that 'my husband abandoned me'. Woah, that was out of line, yeah, that was. Lol.
the reasons for the questions are not so for me. If you are hungry enough for something, you will see through to it. The questions merely point out the contradictions you are facing. What is stopping you? Lacking of a plan or a conviction?
I pointed out incompatibility because its really not about faulting anyone. If a couple needs to suppress themselves all the time for 'peace' in the relationship, then its pretty much a struggle to even get by. You do have the choice, you just need to understand yourself enough to seek your happiness. We will screw up in life, some mistakes are needed for us to realize what is truly important for us. Time can never be reversed and we live with the consequences.
If the thought of your marriage is making you this miserable till a point of depression, what could be worser than remaining in it? What momoftwo feared for and warned could be true, but its something you need to realize yourself. Even if its a mistake to leave, you will not learn to cherish and value it until you come to realization that you needed it.
Your search for happiness isn't restricted to only the perspective of marriage but your life entirely. If you have no choice but to leave, it has to be done then. Previous failed attempts to leave change nothing about that.
Ending marriage is no simple task, you will struggle with it but its something many went through as well. Tough decisions is part and parcel of life.
Danielle, what you didn't or may not have realize with the examples brought up was that you were always in (and dominant) in those conversations. Maybe talking to his friends to understand how he is without your presence.
From what I'm reading, your husband has already long came to the conclusion that its best not to have any opinion in your presence. This isn't so unique actually either. I have heard many guys that concluded its pointless to have a say over anything with their spouse.
Questions about your dad strained relationship with you, wasn't to invade your privacy nor for curiosity sake. It is a suggestion to you that about an observation, you tend to dwell a lot into your own interpretations. To your family, they could feel unheard and confronted all the time by you. I know it is probably never the intention. Going back to ICT now. Ciao.
(Emotional/sexual) Promiscuity isn't the word. Longing for intimacy is. The lack of intimacy from Danielle's husband led her heart temporarily astray, this isn't because of manic depression. Her posts did not indicate manic depression. Keeping people away at an arm's length also keeps away intimacy in any relationship.
She could have engaged a lawyer and paint him negatively but she didn't. It pains her too to choose between her sanity and his. This is not the regular spousal breakdown. It's psychological.-the husband's inaccessibility to both men and women is an affliction almost unheard of. Imagine having to face the numbness in your partner for years.
I think her husband himself is not happy person. His moods are affecting hers too, weighing her down. Danielle would have to tell me if my line strikes a chord.
The other stuff about her father, her career, her temperament are all unintended information that have little to no bearings in her "quest for support" nor are these knowledge a solution for her husband's handicap. I think Danielle is a lot more aware of herself despite saying logic thrown out of the window when it comes to matters of the heart. Certainly not "dwelling into her own interpretations". Danielle's "unintentional shutting down" of others is not the cause of her husband not opening up to her. He's the same to everyone. I repeat, the affliction is not the typical guy thing, not about not lending a listening ear to the wife.
ps: "You.. freedom bird.. will be another lonely chicken chanting to herself..."
-oh, that cracked me up ! The humour of some people.....reminds me of Soisuka.
yeah, i have no idea why being unmarried when u're old, automatically qualifies u to "grow FRAIL and OLD.. and ALL ALONE.."... and be a "another lonely chicken chanting to herself"... haha
it's like there can be no frens, no soul-mates, no future bfren/husband.... i guess some pple shut themselves to the outside world once they are married.
i guess some pple are so marriage-proud that any other paths will derive less happiness.
this part is abit insulting - "And you'll die all alone... just the way you hated it while married to that nice guy you trampled on before... and popping the anti-depressants most divorced idiots end up with."
i can almost sense a deep-seated disdain for pple who divorced.
my heart goes out to you when I read your story. It does seem that you have already decided (have you not?).
If you have already decided, and have already tried and thought things out, then go for it. He may be the perfect guy in everyone else's eyes, but YOU are the one that's living with him and married to him, not them. So what if he is "perfect"? He is not perfect for you.
I think suitability/compatibility is very important in a marriage.
It's normal to feel sad or sentimental, 'cos afterall, no one enters a marriage wanting a divorce.. So yes, of cos there will be such feelings. It's ok.
Another thing, I doubt Danielle's husband has real friends. (I hope not too scathing of a remark) At most, people feel sorry for him but pity is no foundation for true friendship. He has acquaintances, not friends. No "friends" to confide in so no comparison material. Tio boh Danielle ? (am playing psychiatrist)
Danielle is allright, not feeling too bogged down at the moment. You don't need to feel sorry for her. The moral support she asked for was meant to pull her through the divorce, less to do with empathizing with her predicament.
Edit: No "friends" to confide in, so no comparison material whether her "dominance" plays a role on how he acts during her absence. (Being submissive during her presence versus being free during her absence)
The inability to connect cuts off friendships too, not just romantic relationships.
No wonder Danielle has no girl friends.
she's overbearing. Cant seem to tolerate opposing opinions.
Has to be right all the time.
Gets in people faces and force them to see her point. if they don't she get frustrated, and start running around town seeking support to prove she is right.
Anyone who agrees with her is her friend. Anyone who disagree with her is enemy.
in her head, she believes she is sleeping with the enemy, because her husband stood his ground and refused to submit to her rants.
in summary, shes just a Tyrant with low self esteem walking around in high heels.
These type of people can't have deep, meaningful relationship with anyone.
I have been hesitant to reply on many questions you posted so far. You can be very penetrating in the way you look at all my posts and your questions are all very good questions. A few, however, I can only answer later, now I am going to attempt to answer the rest of yours:
2 days ago, you asked:Â "Danielle,Â I was wondering if your husband could have real friends. He goes to Batam or do a boys'-night-out, are those his "mechanical-outings" that do not involve having to tap into his *gasp* social skills ? These are social activities after all"
- He has friends. Basically for guys when they hang out (forgive me, boys, no offence intended, this is just my take), emotional sharing plays only a part of their get-together, unlike girls who see emotional sharing as a much larger part of our get together. Usually the boys might do something, eg: go to a place to drink to listen to music, or watch an all-important soccer match. Sometimes they do just hang out and talk. in fact, i also noticed the younger the age bracket, the more emotive guys have become. (sorry if I just offended older guys out there - moderator, will I be banned? Oops!)
- For the more emotional distant men, if someone is going through a hard time, say had fight with the wife, a fellow friend will probably give him a slap on the back to show camaraderie, with something like "Take it easy, buddy!" and play a game of pool or order another drink. It's like a chill out time not to talk about their problems but to just space out and do something else.
- "Some" might go as far as berating women and say aiya they are all the same la, they got problem la, blah blah. For these "some", its the way they relate to each other.Â Even if many other guys join in and do likewise when they are together, it is more so mainly because they want to be part of the group rather than for any other reason (of courrse its also true their wives are often petty, naggy, eccentric etc) However many when they reach home, they don't behave entirely this way with their spouses. They still love their wives very much.
- Moreover nowadays, our guys are so much more sensitive and emotive and able to connect with female friends. Long gone are the era of MCPs. Now we have our new age sensitive males, as evident all around us, including in this forum. And I am not talking of gay men.
- I hope I am not turning all the guys here against me by my remarks. If so, it's only my pathetic take. If I am wrong, please forgive and correct me.
- My hubby hang out with guys and he is a faithful friend. He is one who lends a helping hand (even financially), he gives you a lift, helps you in concrete ways such as recommend you a suitable financial planning consultant when you need one, or a suitable property agent, or something like that. So, he has friends who value him, and I do value him in this aspect too.
- He is usually funny and likes to joke around and his jokes alone are enough to fill in all the entire dinner and chit-chat time. He is also polite and generous. Throw in the activities like a noisy soccer match afterwards, his lack of emotional sharing is hardly apparent. (to be cont'd)
(cont'd) Â "I'm not sure if I got this right, I have a hunch that he is very lonely. You put is as, "emotionally absent in his daily emotions". I think you meant to say he is apathetically distracted.(I sound ridiculous myself ?) I think he is emotionally occupied with only himself, not so much with his surrounding."
- watching, I agree with you he is very lonely. But he will deny it flatly if ever anyone ask him, and probably sincerely believe so. I won't know ...... "emotionally occupied with only himself" I am not sure. The way i see it is that everyday all the stress and frustrations do take a toll on him, as they take a toll on all of us too, but I see him either suppressing them, denying them, or if all else fail, ventilating by yelling in the shower. Then he will switch off himself and go watch National Geographic or something. Much like sweeping all under the carpet or just escapism tactic. It is a coping mechanism though, but is it a healthy one?
- In "Rain Man" that you mentioned, at least the leading role "woke up" for a while to interact with his surroundings. My hubby hasn't. Sigh!
"Because he is unable to bare himself past acquaintance-level (in order to keep himself at a safe distance), there is no sharing of intimacy. When there is no basic engagement even between friends, then, the friendship will feel unsatisfactory. With partners (husbands/boyfriends) we'd like more than what we get from friends, more intimacy. Danielle's husband is simply inaccessible."
- Yes, safe distance. But from what? That is the question. It's like someone who locks his emotions up tightly in a closet inside him. Now after many years, life is staring in his face to open it, but he can't find the key. Or maybe he still has the key, but the opening of the closet will overwhelm him. I don't know. Maybe both.
- I am high on D in the DISC profile test (a personality assessment) and he is high on S, so there is quite a few areas of potential conflict already. And our different personality types does not help to facilitate him to cross over his barrier of emotional detachment/absence/unavailablity/inaccessiblilty. So my 'dominant' personality does play a part in his clamming up, as what miLo On e RoCks said. If me and him can work out our relationship, D and S are actually highly complementary. But it takes two hands to clap, doesn't it?
"Sian.....I am now feeling lethargic to reply to those groping in the dark."
- Btw watching, yesterday I PM you twice did you receive? About the post I called you 'you sick twisted babe lolol.' I didn't mean it. It was a tease. And if I offended you I am sorry, k?
"(Emotional/sexual) Promiscuity isn't the word. Longing for intimacy is. The lack of intimacy from Danielle's husband led her heart temporarily astray, this isn't because of manic depression. Her posts did not indicate manic depression. Keeping people away at an arm's length also keeps away intimacy in any relationship.Â She could have engaged a lawyer and paint him negatively but she didn't. It pains her too to choose between her sanity and his. This is not the regular spousal breakdown. It's psychological.-the husband's inaccessibility to both men and women is an affliction almost unheard of. Imagine having to face the numbness in your partner for years.Â
I think her husband himself is not happy person. His moods are affecting hers too, weighing her down. Danielle would have to tell me if my line strikes a chord."
- Yes, all the above, very much, babe
"The other stuff about her father, her career, her temperament are all unintended information that have little to no bearings in her "quest for support" nor are these knowledge a solution for her husband's handicap. I think Danielle is a lot more aware of herself despite saying logic thrown out of the window when it comes to matters of the heart. Certainly not "dwelling into her own interpretations".Â
- Yes, I agree. I was off my head when I wrote those. My mentioning of my job and my temperament was uncalled for and really has little to do with my issue here.
i think u lost everyone with your nonsense. u're the only one who seems to think she's being frivolous n wrong blah blah... and u being the one who is ultra-dependent on your hubby.
yes basically only your hubby is trusted to make the right decision, that says much for the frens u Do Not have, nor anyone. and by saying that u're trying to convince everyone that a spouse in needed? i count with both of my hands the number of pple who can make that decision.
yes yes, i also had the opportunity to be a lawyer, so anything i said relating to law is immediately more credible than yours.
yes yes i had the chance to do medicine, so i am have more weight in my words than u, since yours is just some healthcare directive...
what kinds of moronic credibility do u hope to conjure by merely mentioning opportunities Not Taken? this reminds me of a forummer in the past who Has to mention in every post how she gave up a high-flying career...
it's like for some reason, by saying that, i will sit up and respect her... or u for that matter. as far as i'm concerned, u are lost in your own mind trying to protect your own cause... Danielles happiness isn't even of concern to u... u're more interested in her keeping to a marriage so that u can sleep better at nite.
this whole thing has turned into your personal agenda.
and suddenly i am a bachelor... the number of Wrong assumptions u make is enough to kill a nation. u're the one having limited communication and exposure to humans, and u're asking me if u need to switch to baby language.
u're a just a sore loser hiding behind an intact marriage to be condescending.
u better wish your husband stays with u... i cannot imagine how u can handle marriage if it's no longer stable.
how many pple have u interacted with today outside of family?
- about my dad and me, though it is not relevant to my marital situation, I might tell another day. Just to share. You might find it interesting. Who knows.
'ps: "You.. freedom bird.. will be another lonely chicken chanting to herself..." '
- LOLOLOLOL yet again : )
"Another thing, I doubt Danielle's husband has real friends. (I hope not too scathing of a remark) At most, people feel sorry for him but pity is no foundation for true friendship. He has acquaintances, not friends. No "friends" to confide in, so no comparison material, whether her "dominance" plays a role on how he acts during her absence. (Being submissive during her presence versus being free during her absence) Tio boh Danielle ? (am playing psychiatrist)" (with edit)
- Of course it is not a scathing remark. Your intentions are pure. Moreover i think you are making an observation here. I appreciate your feedback. Thanks.
- Yes, he doesn't share with his friends. His male friends apparently share problems with him and he will help in tangible ways. Ha!
- I know most of his friends. They sometimes come over to our place for Saturday nights soccer marathons. Believe it or not, I can talk to them lol! Here are 2 examples: there was this guy who is religious and we were discussing about religion and stuff and his sharing were full of emotive words. Another one told me about his new girlfriend (he is a recent widow) the first time I met and talked to him, much to the astonishment of my hubby. Hubby later asked me "he told you that? How strange. You just meet him for the first time!" ItÂ was perhaps hard for him to understand why things so 'personal' can be said on a first meet.
- watching, you should go be a psychiatrist, you have a flair for stuff like this
- About the 'dominant' thing, I wish I can say Tio to you, but I am afraid my rather strong personality might have added to his reasons why he should remain as he is in the marriage.
- Outside the marriage, he does not get any feedback on this matter. In my opinion, guys (pardon me, boys, if i say it wrongly, this is just my take) usually just respect you as you are and might not want to comment, unless they think it necessary? Except for my male friend who was 'big mouth' enough to go and ask him 'eh how come you don't share your opinion wan har?' Next thing hubby told me, on the way home, he doesn't like this guy. Lol.
"Danielle is allright, not feeling too bogged down at the moment."
- No. Not bogged down at all. So far this forum has been kind to me, thanks to everyone. Scope guy or our dear forumer who said I am promiscuous: they do not affect me the least. Not a scratch. The trigger that can upset my depression medication is my hubby. So far this 2 weeks i have coped well and protected myself. I will be off med very soon
Watching, I appreciate your insights and feedback XOXO
miLo On e RoCks, I assume you are asking these questions? Or are they just for me? Anyway:
"If you are hungry enough for something, you will see through to it. The questions merely point out the contradictions you are facing. What is stopping you? Lacking of a plan or a conviction?"
- what is stopping me is my weakness
"You do have the choice, you just need to understand yourself enough to seek your happiness. We will screw up in life, some mistakes are needed for us to realize what is truly important for us."
- Yes, perhaps I need to dig deeper to understand myself more
- I am not afraid of screwing up, miLo. I am afraid of hurting people.Â
- I am very aware what is important to me now. If you are my good friend, miLo, I will gladly throw myself in front of an oncoming truck to save your life. This is what is very important to me.
"What momoftwo feared for and warned could be true, but its something you need to realize yourself. Even if its a mistake to leave, you will not learn to cherish and value it until you come to realization that you needed it."
- Momoftwo's fear stems from her misunderstanding that I am illogical to make a decision now because of my 'clinical depression'. If you read her posts amd my posts in context, you will realise her fear is invalid.
- Irrelevant point because my weakness is not due to fear of making a mistake.
"Your search for happiness isn't restricted to only the perspective of marriage but your life entirely. If you have no choice but to leave, it has to be done then. Previous failed attempts to leave change nothing about that."
- miLo, my gut feel tells me this time I will fail even worse and faster than before.Â During previous attempts I felt stronger. This time I felt weaker than the precious attempts.
- One must always learn from the past mistakes. As I have earlier quoted Albert Einstein, doing the same thing over and over again will not yield the same results. This time, I am trying out online forum for some kind of support. This is my attempt to do a different thing, so that I can get the desired results.
"Ending marriage is no simple task, you will struggle with it but its something many went through as well."
- My point exactly. Hence I am in this forum, miLo.
"Danielle, what you didn't or may not have realize with the examples brought up was that you were always in (and dominant) in those conversations. Maybe talking to his friends to understand how he is without your presence."
- miLo, insofar as jokes, news and facades are concerned, my hubby is dominant in conversations among friends. Once the topic starts on anything bordering opinions or emotions or aspirations, he will withdraw. Naturally, I will appear dominant in the conversation, wouldn't I?
- While he has some beer buddies some of whom i know personally, most of our friends are mutual friends or ex-classmates from the same school we attended. It is very difficult to detect his 'emotional detachment' amongst friends. All I'd ever gathered from some of them is that they had never heard him talk about his personal stuff such as his own family, except how many siblings he has or what his parents work as. Demographics, basically.
"Questions about your dad strained relationship with you, wasn't to invade your privacy nor for curiosity sake. .... Â To your family, they could feel unheard and confronted all the time by you. I know it is probably never the intention."
- I wouldn't be sharing today. In fact I was drafting my reply but I stopped short. I am not prepared to share today. You will come to know one day that your assumptions of my family dynamics can't be more wrong.
"VERY CURIOUS" my ass... tat itself is a lie. pple who are curious Tend to find out.. and those who are Very Curious would put in even more effort than just declaring they are. u're just rubbing your chin standing on your throne declaring interest.
u ask me if i'm married - when an ongoing thread can give u the freakin answer. u dun even have to dig old threads... that's how curious u are. "VERY CURIOUS" my ass...
and u have cow-sense... just becos i LISTENED, Processed and Encouraged a person to look beyond - and LIVE her Life... which might mean leaving the marriage - u say i am pro-divorce. i dun really care, cos being pro-divorce is not even wrong... u just make it sound like a dirty word becos of your need to be freakin married.
am i a divorce lawyer? where's the freakin logic u expect from me when u dun even possess it?
so i guess your mind can only process this way...
encourage leaving marriage in 1 case => pro-divorce => likely divorced, not married, is a divorce lawyer.
2nd, u're full of sh!t. able to dish but unable to receive. the more u post, the more credibility u are losing... or rather u have none now.
3rd - u actually think u're in position to address "pple"?
how abt u start by telling me what u do? exclude lessons u DID NOT attend... and courses which brochures are lying around your home. basically u can share your life experiences, if any... outside of marriage and family.
"- miLo, insofar as jokes, news and facades are concerned, my hubby is dominant in conversations among friends. Once the topic starts on anything bordering opinions or emotions or aspirations, he will withdraw. Naturally, I will appear dominant in the conversation, wouldn't I? "
its an observation not just from the use cases you spoke about but rather entirely, from your responses etc. You have a say over many things and expecting your husband to be likewise. Its understandable for a person that is more emotionally extrovert. However, there is also nothing so wrong or weird of someone to not enjoy talking the same manner either. You can call it emotional absent, for him, its probably something he isn't comfortable commenting about. Not everyone have an opinion over everything and needing to voice them out.
I assure you that you do not need to share about your dad. The feedback is really providing you another view. If it is indeed irrelevant, then let it be. We can only read from what was observed and shared in here and I respect your need for privacy.
"I am not afraid of screwing up, miLo. I am afraid of hurting people."
Consequences of decisions often do not just affect ourselves. Hanging on an unhappy and incompatible marriage has its consequences as well. As much as you fear hurting him, your unhappiness in the marriage is hurting him as well.